Violence, R18+ And Games: Watch Gizmodo on 7 Sunrise


    Wow, that ACL guy just spouted a big load of nothing.

      as usual. this is why, despite being Christian, I am seriously considering not putting that on my census... because it would promote the ACL.

      and its not just about the R18+ issue. these guys are seriously detrimental to society, and civilisation... and have a worrying amount of influence over the politics...

        Well said matt. Former catholic here. It's one thing to have a faith, but being 'represented' by douches makes it difficult!

        I get the same thing with 'atheists' or religion-haters. Make me look bad just because I choose not to follow a religion.

        Things like the 'christian' lobby are just clubs.

          Hey, it's no bag of crisps being an atheist either! I arrived at my (lack of) belief of my volition many years ago, without getting swept up in Dawkins mania and bull crap like 'teaching religion is akin to child abuse'.

          But atheists seem to get bagged out even more than conservative christian's in talk backs these days. I didn't become an atheist because I wanted to debate, I became one because I decided there was no debate, it's a tap out people, I'm of the mat, stop trying to put me in a head lock.

          Basically 95% of people who claim to be mouth pieces for any particular group on television represent either extreme or crudely simplistic views of what people actually believe, the morons in the ACL are just prime examples.

            Really, it's partly because there are as many arsehole 'atheists' out there as there are arsehole 'christians'.

            Really, those sort of atheists are kind of practicing their own religion of atheism.

        The problem with religion is that mortals become involved and corrupt it

    Not to Jim Wallace - look to;

    - Church "ripping" children from their parents last century...
    - Church's role in the "Stolen Generation"
    - Church/Christian clergy abuse of children.
    - Religious intolerance based conflicts in the world today as well as the past.
    - The rise of fundamentalism across many religious groups including Christians.
    - Catholic Church's role in the proliferation of Aids in 3rd world countries due to stance on birth control

    ...Let's compare and contrast the role of religion and it's harmful impact on hundreds of thousands - to millions of people over the past 200 years.

    Then let's have a debate about the "real" role a single computer game has in shooting massacres.

    Before games, it was Movies..."A Clockwork Orange" anybody? Before Movies it was books - censored or banned by religious bodies....

    Jim your religious belief is matched only by your ignorance and narrow-mindedness.

    Nice opening comments Seamus...

      Well Said... Completely correct.

      Very well said.

      You forgot to mention the latest which is the church responsible for, in the 60s and 70s of taking new born babies from their mothers and adopting them out immediately after their birth. The mothers drugged and restrained and not allowed to see their new borns. Also the churches forged signatures of the mothers on documents. This occurred all over Australia.

      I'm a raging atheist but it's obvious even to me that the various's churches are also responsible for more social work and providing services to the needy in Australia than any state or federal government agency or private group. By a very large margin. You think the Department of Child Protection does anything to help mothers in disadvantaged situations care for their kids or improve themselves? Nope they just remove the kids if there's a complaint. It's the church organisations that help the parents get sorted out to get their kids back. And they do that without insisting people come to church or baptise their children.

      In fact if every religous organisation in Australia packed up tomorrow we'd have a serious social services crisis on our hands. (although I'd imagine many people would continue to work as volunteers).

      It's very easy to list a bunch of abhorrent crimes religion has been implicit in, a lot easier to admit they do a helluva lot of good work as well.

        I have to agree Aaron. It's very easy to take the moral high ground against religious fundamentalists, particularly in Australia. However, from a sociological point of view our Western morals are born from Christian heritages. Non-Western societies, and non-'Christian' cultures, would have a very different opinion on what we take for granted.

    There is no place in politics for religion. Religion always has and always will be a main front for conflict and war.

    This is stupid, How many people play these games ??? and only 1 goes crazy and kills people... even without these games he most likely would have done it anyway.....

    Some people are naturally twisted, for example millions of people own pets, a very small amount of these people hurt / torture them... we don't see owning pets being banned......

    Its like people that are drug addicts... Everyone blames the drugs doing it to them when its really themselves... most drug addicts would have already been messed up, non motivated, dero, useless people to start with.....

    My point with the drugs is they are illegal and has that fixed our drug problem ???... NO so how is banning violent video games going to solve our crazy people problem.... IT WONT...

    Damn work PC... i cant view this video on here and it wont play on iPhone either. Anyone got a YouTube link?

      Doesn't the iPhone do flash? I thought modern smartphones had flash support?

        smartpeople would realise that flash is an abomination :)

          Nah, smart people would realize that not including flash on an internet connected device is an incredibly illogical idea regardless of their opinion of flash. After all it's not just gonna magically disappear from the internet no matter how many times you say it's crappy :P

      Just streamed the whole segment on my Desire over 3G before posting this. Flash is such a burden....

      Just streamed the whole segment straight to my Desire over 3G before posting this. Having Flash is such a burden....

    50 years, they'll be hardly any more Christians, believe me.

      I agree, Someone will ban them..... lol

    Wasn't this guy a crazy right wing christian and his attack was more a protest about the Islamification of Europe? I didn't watch Sunrise but I hope Seamus brought this up. This guy's crazy right wing views had more to do with this than video games...

    50 years and they'll be hardly any more video games is more like it.

    Unfortunately :(

    Douchebags are douchebags no matter what they believe or where they come from in society.

    Don't judge whole religions the acts of the few. Otherwise you become what you hate the supposed Free World vs Islam.

    I love it how people are so quick to defend video games, saying you can't use events like this as a blanket across a whole medium, but then they'll turn around and say that it's all religion's fault.

      Watch it again. I said that Christians should NOT have to answer for the work of a madman.

      But if Wallace suggests videogames have to answer for their influence on this man, then why do they not feel religion and conservative politics have anything to answer for? If we hold them to the standards they place upon videogames, they themselves have serious questions to answer.

        More referring to the comments here than the video itself.

          Not unlike Nige (lower down in comments) I was bought up a catholic and am now quite amazed and entertained(in a comic sense) by the now regular religous rants. The rant deliverers masquerade as fonts of informational accuracy while delivering questionable facts, validated by questionable collection methods gathered from skewed sample groups. Seamus I would say you haves taken the reasonable ground because you can neither prove/nor disprove that violent video games foster violence. Nor for that matter can anyone else... There is no genuinely significant and valid data either way... If the people who commit massacres around the world could all be questioned and the data could be considered to be reasonably accurate and they predominantly said that 'Call of Duty made me do it'... I might take it seriously... Until then I know the most likely reason for the massacre... Is not likely to be a sane, rational or quantifiable one.

            Thanks. That was my aim. To point out that no one but the terrorist can be blamed. But if people like Wallace want to point fingers, they should be very careful lest they be forced to point at themselves.

      People aren't saying its religions fault, But when you have a christian group saying its influenced by video games it is frustrating because people believe this, buts its quite obvious that his religion has influenced his views which has become his motive....

      His Motive was to remove Muslims correct ?

      So even if you say Video games are what trained him (total BS) it would have been irreverent without a motive which was influenced by religious beliefs

    Who are his 21 (I think) experts that he is going on about? Are these the same experts that were proven to be wrong?

      It's interesting that the ACL and the ACCM often talk about their vast library of studies and research reinforcing their arguements, but they never, ever cite examples. If they were at uni, they would have failed every assignment with that attitude.

        I once sent a solicited email to the ACL asking them to site the source mentioned in a certain media article. The email was correctly written and addressed to the email address that seemed appropriate on their site.

        I never got a response. How embarrassing for a lobby group that likes to take itself so seriously.

    I see where Jim is coming from.
    I'm also a major fan of video games.
    Being a follower of Jesus I know that there is a tonne of stuff in the world that does not follow what the bible says we should do.

    Eg. Massacres
    the silly bugger in Oslo is an idiot for thinking he was doing God's work.

    Then onto the other side of this topic, We shouldnt ban video games as a first step of fixing this issue... Martin Bryant allegedly played Doom or Quake before ther Port Arthur Massacre in the '90s.
    Instead of the Ban, there needs to be ratings in place, laws to enforce them and education for the parents so they know what not to buy. This needs to be followed up by teaching kids that although their parents may break the law to give them what they want, they need to understand they cant always have what they want. They cant harm people because the people have a different view. They can't kill people because they may be "wrong".

    It's not the parents fault necessarily, its not the video game industry.

    If we ban video games, we need to ban violent tv and movies and the nightly news as this COULD affect younger (and other) viewers negatively.

    My view,

    Step 1) Define Violence, Super Mario, Ben 10 and Manhunt are all violent.
    Step 2) Educate
    Step 3) Ban individual people if mentally unstable from the purchase of ratings over G.
    Step 4) Limit video games to people over 15.
    Step 5) If we still have massacres, tighten weapon laws.
    Step 6) May as well Ban Everything because even Mean Girls 2 the movie (and the Lion King) has violence and revenge in it.

    The usual high standard of journalistic balance from Sunrise - as always looking for the shit-stir.
    Seamus: 1:07 of airtime
    Wallace: 2:23 of airtime (twice as long to rant)
    Good on ya Channel 7

    Shamus gave us a well reasoned argument about the possible motivation for the killers action, the impetus to inspire him to kill.
    Wallace illustrated the similarities between scenes in one particular game and how the killer went about satisfying his beliefs.

    I don't know about others, but to me it's more important to find out why someone kills others rather than how he kills. You need the inspiration/motivation/conviction first, this is the poison. The method is irrelevant.

      Your final paragraph, Pete, is perfect. Snaps to you for being able to sum it up so nicely.

      Interesting that nobody's officially proposed banning Christianity, given its frankly abysmal record in the "motivation for massacres" department... Just sayin'

      And yes, I was raised a Catholic... I have seen the way things work, which is why religion scares the $&@! out of me!

      As mentioned before it just goes to show that Religion, which being a system of belief should not be mixed with politics or journalism.

      Whats to say that the air time is no shared equally because they are playing to the audience that would easily jump to a conclusion in favour of who backs the system that pays the bills.

    Just emailed sunrise asking for a follow up with fair air time to respond from both parties, suggest everyone does the same

    To you, Seamus, I tip my hat, sir. Your screen time, though far too brief, was both beautifully worded and assassin-like in its delivery. We had ACL stalwart Rob Ward on our radio show this morning and I was bestowed the honour of asking him "what did we blame massacres on before video games were invented?". I cannot tell a lie, that drew a fairly significant pause from him. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, even our playa-hating compadres at the ACL, that's what democracy is... but any sane person with the capacity for abstract thought can see that playing MW2 can't train you to be a soldier any more than playing Tetris can train you as a bricklayer. And WoW? As a military training simulator? Let's just let that one go through to the keeper, shall we? Lest I start slinging too much mud. Peace out, brothers and sisters... Viva la common sense, that's all I ask.

    So scary. There are laws to govern & put classifications on video games but no laws to govern & put classifications on religion.

    They really should put a R18+ rating for "Religion" - afterall, it contains (& have led to) violence, war, adultery and more.

    We should ban the wearing of SKINS performance clothing. He would never have injured as many people as he did if he was not performing at the top of his game due to his skins bodysuit.

    It frustrates me that when these things happen we all want to blame someone or something and then BAN it. Also dont get me started on the media....... there was a reason i stoped watching and listening to commerical TV & radio.

    Oh and that was not a debate. That was one person aired their opinions and then another aired their opinions with the abilty to put minor rebuttals in. 3 minutes was all the air time the could give them. Well done Ch 7.

    Seamus that was GOLD. also, ACL guy getting out the sheets of paper? Gawd.

    Love it,

    the ACL spokesperson said something along the lines of "If anything can spark 1 or 2 people to do this, then it should be banned"

    So...He was a christian extremist.....

    Ban the Bible?

    it actually works in our favour. games that were accessible by minors won't be anymore.

    ACL... haha what a joke, and they say video games are a waste of time, how about dedicating your life to a fictional character.

    your days are numbered religon

    Ok so out of curiosity went looking for and found the manifesto.

    I did a search in the browser for "modern Warfare" which turned up 9 results. 1 referring to the game as a training medium, 3 referring the game in general and 5 referring to current warfare techniques.

    I next did a search for "Christ" which brought up 255 results and "Christian" which returned 2218 results.

    So yeah I'll leave you to make you you own minds.

    Since (or so i have heard) the bible deals with sensitive topics, I think the bible should be banned for under 18s.
    Otherwise it's like reading the G rated content from a playboy magazine to a bunch of kids.
    I should've been a lawyer.

      It's filthy stuff, genital mutilation, drunken incestuous orgies, murders and butcherings, child killings.

      And yet it's a required text in every school in Australia.

    Which has been responsible for more horrific acts? Christianity or Video Games?

    I heard he drank water.

    I think it's about time that this was banned as I've heard other pschopaths did this too..

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