Let the wave of "OMFG H4X0R I pWN3d J00 with my Xbox360" crowd consumer the comments. This should be amusing.

imTheKing

@Kaiser-Machead:
For me crap is crap, whether it is thrown or unthrown, I don't like crap, Crap I ap.

jellobrains

@lankysob:

"Built" is not correct in this context. Here, the phrase "architected" refers to high-level design...not implementation. All subsequent implementation (or "building") must live within the confines of that architecture.

BTW, the term "built" in the software industry generally means something very different than what you appear to wish to convey. We tend to use "implement", "code", etc...since "building" is normally associated with the (often automated) process used to assemble system components into one or more deployable/executable components.

I'm not trying to be pedantic, but you should realize that outside of your domain, similar terms may be used with slightly different meanings.

Scuba
Software Architect, Computer Scientist, Software Engineer...with a BSEE ;-)

scuba_steve_1

We buy computers for one reason: to use software. The biggest tragedy of the virus and reliability problems of the Windows experience is how non-techie users are made afraid of software... afraid of the very reason they use computers.

Most people reading and posting on sites like this don't have the perspective and/or compassion to understand just how miserable this fear of software is for the non-techie computer-using population.

I've been teaching a beginner Mac class every weekend the last six years. Non-techie users move to Mac to escape The Fear, but are nonetheless still essentially frozen with uncertainty. It's very hard and sad to witness, and finding freedom from this fear has become one of the primary themes of my class, and one of my greatest joys is when I see people excited about using software again.

If you help or support people who are afraid or uncertain about software, one of the greatest gifts you can offer is guidance on how to use computers without the fear.

jeremedia

You're absolutely right, Shub. I tweak the **** out of my Windows installs, which is why I love Windows.

With great power comes great responsibility.

Iron Sheep

@ideaman2020: LOL. I wasn't sure if someone else had Simpsons on the mind. I was trying to go for the Comic Book Guy's tone, but I guess without tags, it's lost in translation.

Kaiser-Machead

@Mona: Crap - "Bingo" disappeared from the above comment. Oh, well.

Mona

"The flipside of this-which you might not have considered-is that most malware writers obviously use Windows. They're going to whip up code for the OS they're familiar with and know best." just figured out how to delete encrypted files Air plugged somewhere in my HD and were left behind long after I deleted the app. Note to self: Learn OS X

Mona

since there'd be a lot more thrown crap thrown at the Mac OS

Man, I hate when someone picks up pre-thrown crap, and throws it again. Sure, it's recycling, but c'mon, once is enough.

Kaiser-Machead

@lankysob: As a software engineer, I submit that is perfectly cromulent usage.

The word "architected" embiggens us all.

ideaman2020

@lankysob: Oh please, the correct term, or at least the term I believe should be penned in Webster's bible, is Architectuated, as it has an engineer-y, sensual quality that we can all enjoy. Thank you.

Kaiser-Machead

*sigh*

the apple world is like the closed gate community of eden, someone let me in!!

pevans34

@lankysob: The OS is first designed (or architected) that way. Then developed/programmed/built.

Rabid Penguin

And this is why I run Linux, the virus immunity of OS X without the bajillion dollar price tag.

Ninja_of_Techno

"Unix-based systems are architected so that they require administrator privileges"

'architected'?

As an actual architect, that makes me cry.
How about 'built'?

lankysob

@Shub-Niggurath: sounds like something I have heard before

lilaliendog

@Shub-Niggurath: scratch linux, linux is in NO WAY for soft pink hands.

Shub-Niggurath

@cardboredbox:
Agreed

*moderate speed clap*

ajlafontaine

"Something you still wanna know? Send any questions about viruses, VD or the 1995 Dustin Hoffman film Outbreak to tips@gizmodo.com," - Hilarious!

pdditty

so what you're saying is:

If you like f-ing around in your OS's guts, and know how to avoid and fight viruses, get windows XP.

If you dont want to get your soft pink hands dirty, get X.

If you're in between, get Linux or hopefully 7.

Shub-Niggurath

an Apple vs MS article that's not overtly bias

*slow clap*

cardboredbox

AWE, that's the CUTEST pic ever! Friends again!

vgart

@Shub-Niggurath: Just because you know how to avoid and fight viruses doesn't mean you should have to. With Mac OS X, it isn't dumbing itself down to the user. The user can be as fluent or ignorant as he wants. Obviously more knowledge is better, but you can get by without it. But thats the point. You can have more knowledge, and then do far more with that knowledge. Basically, I'm just pointing out that you said that X is for wimps. Which is not true and inaccurate.

moo083

"The main applications folder is relatively unprotected, and any running app can write to it and most of what's inside."

only if, like a fool, you run your personal user account as an administrator or install applications with your non admin account and don't correct the permissions

Gonzie

@Kaiser-Machead: Great minds think alike.

... and so do ours! ;-)

ideaman2020

Windows has 90% of the OS market, so virus writers typically write for windows. OS X has been steadily gaining ground.. along with it's viruses.

[www.informationweek.com]

(i use both mac and win btw)

kevininstereo

@scuba_steve_1: They are commenting about the fact that "architected" is not actually a word in the English language.

Xenocide

@Rabid Penguin: @Kaiser-Machead: @ideaman2020: @scuba_steve_1: Being an avid Gizmodian (and collector of things shiny and expensive) I know that the term 'architect' has meanings beyond the world I work in. But, I have never heard it used in such a manner...and to me it didn't seem to fit (being an occasional member of the Grammar Police). From now on, when I refer to the buildings/structures that I design and work on, I will say that I 'architected' them as opposed to 'designed' or 'built' (if I had a hand in that). Thank you all for setting me straight.

lankysob

@jellobrains: My comment is all f*cked up and makes NO sense at all LOL /end.

Mona

@Shub-Niggurath: WHY would you even waste time hunting and pecking through your OS?

Mona

@ajlafontaine: *speedy clap with vocal cheers*

John_001

i've never had a virus, on either mac os or windows, mainly cause i never open files labeled "britneynude.exe."

i take that back. i did get the merry x-mas virus for hypercard back in the day. to the best of my knowledge that didn't do anything harmful though.

srdailey

There is one more important difference:
OS X doesn't advertise itself on the network and doesn't keep tons of ports open just for fun by default. The OS is pretty much invisible on the network therefore scanning robots don't find it easily. In contrast, Windows PC's have lots of listening ports open even on a virgin system. All of them are waiting for possible attacks. Or even if those ports are not vulnerable, they still make it obvious that the IP address exists so it's worth coming back for it later.

zmd21

Y'know what I've never understood... with all the Mac hate out there, you would think that some disgruntled fanboy would write a virus to stick it to mac users "who think they can be all protected without an antivirus"... but there really hasn't been anything major to hit Macs. Maybe the fanboys are just dumb or lazy?

SAN66

@Kaiser-Machead: Actually, pre-thrown crap is better than fresh crap since, when it is thrown again, you know it is really crap this time.

Does that even make sense? Crap.

Monty

@ajlafontaine: @cardboredbox: now will both of you stop whining?

imTheKing

@Mona: This post is getting crappy.

jellobrains

@Kaiser-Machead:
Now that you've clarified that, your post is 1000% better.

Best...post...ever!

timbrews

@Iron Sheep: Ya - then you have to go treasure hunting to make sure sh*t is completely removed. Don't forget the DLLs! Simplification ftw.

Mona

@lankysob: The purpose of this word now is to return to the dictionary, upon which point it will disseminate the code it carries reinserting the prime program. Failure to comply with this process will result in a cataclysmic system crash unraveling the very lexicon of the species, coupled with the degradation of blog comments to truncated LOLspeak and txt msg gobbledegook, will result in the extinction of the entire human race.

Kaiser-Machead

@Mona:

why hunt and peck through ANY code? to mess with it, of course.

nutbastard: Don't blame me i voted for Ron Paul edition

As of now, security through obscurity, while not the best way to be safe, IS pretty much a comforting "safe in numbers(or lack thereof)" place to be at the moment. Hackers simply not caring is a lot like thieves being uninterested in your house, despite your security measures not being 100% impenetrable. Works for me.

Kaiser-Machead

@kevininstereo: you should update your info... or read further than the headlines.

sos10

@pevans34: sorry bub, you have to buy your way in to this and every gated community.

theninjaelephant

@Iron Sheep: I have a new-found love of XP after reading Lifehacker's articles on custom desktop mods and personalization. I'm still a newb at it but I love Samurize. It's just a shame that other programs I love (see:RocketDock, Songbird) are Mac copycats.

John_001

@zmd21: so very true. Windows is basically an open system security-wise out of the box. You have to do a ton of protection to make it even slightly secure...

anti-hello-kitty

hint: open source software would be really easy to write malware for if someone actually cared (cough*linux/freebsd*cough)

xxjudgmentxx

@moo083: I didnt say that X was for wimps, and I agree with you. I have soft pink hands, myself. AND I use all three OS's.

So **sticks out tongue**!

:P

Shub-Niggurath

Science and Technology is FUN...

Go Team Venture

@SAN66: That's what I've always wondered. When the peanut gallery starts going on about wiping the smirks off of the more arrogant users' faces, nothing becomes of it. I suppose that in the end, they may just not be interested enough to build an adequate hackintosh, or buy a regular Mac to get working on this, but really, where's the love you malware-doling key-tapping codemonkeys?

Kaiser-Machead

Good stuff.

Once people realized there was more money in spyware than viruses the whole virus craze around the start of this century seems to have largely passed. And even spyware is becoming less of a threat with regular updates to the OS and mainstream browsers. Phishing and social engineering (sort of alluded to in the last paragraph) are quickly becoming the biggest threat now, and they're mostly OS agnostic.

Ron-Mexico

@pevans34: It'll be $2,000 or your first born son.

Woden501

@cardboredbox: *Last clap* /Peter

highfloydelity

@lankysob:
lol. It's just fancy business lingo to make you sound more important. Which sounds more business friendly and will more likely fool people into thinking you know what you're talking about:

1) Yeah, I helped build that shit.

- OR -

2) I was part of a small team that architected the multi-tier solution our company is currently utilizing.

Rabid Penguin

@beekerstudios: let me rephrase that, the only open os, happens to be a free one, Linux. If M$ or Apple gave their OS away for free (apple basically does when you buy their hardware), it doesn't mean it's open.

beekerstudios

@cardboredbox: *inspirational music*

Qwertyfreak is jumping on the bandwagon

@vgart: *emotional music*

Qwertyfreak is jumping on the bandwagon

@Shub-Niggurath: regedits is considered f-ing with the guts of the OS, I think not. You people are funny, the only true open OS is a free one, Linux FTW. BTW I use everything, but am under no dillusion that windows is somehow more open then OS X, now if you're talking about hardware, that's a different story, and I think the resounding amount of hackintoshes can dispute that argument at this point (not sanctioned but it's possible)

beekerstudios

@Kaiser-Machead: I personally think part of the reason they do it is because they probably despise a lot of what Microsoft has done / created. Everyone knows that Microsoft has dropped the ball on their OS more than any company has dropped the ball on any product.

imTheKing

@nutbastard: Don't blame me i voted for Ron Paul edition: Software, I understand but for an OS? To make something that's supposed to work - actually work? Why?! It's a waste of time!

Mona

@vgart:

NEVER. OSX will rule alone :]

iFans, Gather behind me.

@lankysob: Sadly, I think this is simply a case of a group co-opting a term for their use without receiving permission of the originators. In the case of really nerdy software development, it's a perfectly suitable verb--perhaps because it sounds so nerdy. (Gizmodo is intentionally full of words that don't appear in the OED... yet.) But I am afraid you won't be understood so well if you try to use it when pitching a design to the Japanese investors who--at least in movies--are always looking for fresh architecture. It's just not, and never will be, as aesthetically pleasing as "designed," "conceived" or any number of synonyms. It's your fault for choosing a profession where emotional impact counts!

Wilson Rothman

This part: "First, Windows is on 89.6 percent of the world's computers" is wrong. Worlds computers also implies every server and other computing machine, where as the linked article was talking about personal computers.

It is an important distinction, and also helps to explain where the security of OS X and Linux came from. Unix has (and still does via official and knockoffs like Linux) command a large share of the market on servers. Servers were in the past the main interest to hackers, due to them being online all the time and usually connected to stable internet connections. Thus, the Unixes of the world had to be hardened to survive. Windows is a relative newcomer to the internet world, not really achieving a large server market share until the new internet age of more common folks using it. Now you have a relatively unsecured OS running not only on a bunch of machines hooked to cable modems and such, but the same OS running on a bunch of servers. SQL Slammer was a really nasty windows server only virus that did a lot of harm, around the time Code Red ran around every windows machine.

Microsoft's future is UNIX's past. Microsoft hasn't looked at history well enough to adopt their single user/single PC OS to a connected world, though they are trying. Where as Unix started its life in a connected world and had to adapt quickly.

drakino

Heh, so if most malware coders use windows, then there is actually a possibility of the virus coming back and getting them? that would be so awesome.

roflwaffles

@John_001:
*full standing ovation*

roflwaffles

@Xenocide:

..understood, but unlike the French, most native English speakers do not live in a country that has language police...and I submit that the phrase "architected" is used routinely in my field to convey an activity. It is used and understood. Hence, it is a word...albeit an awkward word.

The term "Googled" was used routinely prior to it gaining recognition by Webster's. Did Webster's actually make it a word? Are they empowered to do so by some authority? Did the use of the word "Googled" to imply the past tense of the (also informal) verb "Google" not exist prior to that date...and did its usage cause mass confusion and general panic?

Our language evolves. At times, it evolves on a mass scale due to a widespread phenomenon...like a pop culture event...or, as in the case with Google, the advent of the internet. At other times, it evolves in an isolated area or domain. I accept that "architected" is an example of the latter and not the former...and thus, will most likely not make it into Webster's...but that fact does not negate its value within a community.

That said, I'll agree that one should avoid using such terms when addressing an audience outside of the community...and that I am now in "full-goose turbo pedantic mode."

cheers,
Steve

scuba_steve_1

@Kaiser-Machead:

geez, way to make a guy down on his financial luck ashamed of having to purchase pre-thrown crap exclusively lately...

nutbastard: Don't blame me i voted for Ron Paul edition

@kevininstereo: you didn't read at all did you.

imTheKing

@Ninja_of_Techno: Hey, Apple isn't THAT overpriced. Most Macs are just under *half* a bajillion dollars.

gus2000

Thanks, Giz. That clears things up for me because most posts just post about bunch of stupid opinions completely unbacked by facts.

MBPro

I don't have anti-virus software on either my Windows XP Desktop or my Macbook w/ OS X Leopard. On my Windows XP machine, the firewall is disabled, since routers have one already.

I never get viruses on either machine, and most viruses I see people get are due to stupid users.

If you download things that you know you want (not random .exe's you find), use Firefox 3 for browsing, and perhaps use webmail (gmail) instead of Outlook, I don't see much to worry about.

I know how to manually kill and remove startup malware from the registry too though, as I've done it on other machines, so I'm probably still more prepared than the average user though.

Guard

@Ninja_of_Techno: or the usability research. ;-)

Seriously, I'm generally a Windows person, and have done tons with Linux, but OSX has had way more done to make it usable than either of the other two, especially Linux (since open source people tend to be programmers, not designers). I really wish some of the really good innovation going on in the usability area would find it's way into Linux (and Linux apps) - I think if it did, Linux would get a much better market share.

Sean Robertson

@highfloydelity:

Hardy case of the clap.

MyPetFly

VMplayer + Browser Appliance = No viruses! get with it people the virtual machine era is upon us!

armendni

@xxjudgmentxx: thankfully nobody does care... and won't care for a long time. it's like 1% of the market. Who would waste their time on that? but the best part is that the hackers beating up on XP are actually writing useful code FOR linux. Huzzah!

armendni

@cardboredbox: *Pans to me as a tear forms*

bendis79

I'm a longtime PC and Mac user and have never been infected with a virus on EITHER OS. It's relatively hard to catch a virus or get infected with spyware/malware if you are smarter than the computer.

DaneB

@Shub-Niggurath: linux is for people who want to completely f with their os's guts. while having good security for pink hands lol. wait i don't get the pink thing or the in between thing.

armendni

@Qwertyfreak is jumping on the bandwagon: *which has just stopped since iFans, Gather behind me has entered the discussion*
Man, that ended quickly.

Qwertyfreak is jumping on the bandwagon

@vgart: haha keep your friends close and your enemies closer right?

armendni

So from the responses in this forum post OSX user want to be lazy and not have to know how there OS works. Ignorance is bliss, I can understand how some people feel that way. My question is why are these people reading a tech page? If you like ignorance go play with your facebook page.

dropdeadcriminal

Every attempt from microsoft to enforce security measures are descibed as:
- Annoying
- Abuse of monopoly
- Not sharing enough information
- Unfair practises

Microsoft can only slowly educate people for this, UAC being a couple of steps too far already.

People are the main security hole. They are lazy.

Herman

@Rabid Penguin: That I also know. There is a whole different language that architects can get sucked up into if they're not careful. It's full of rich, flowery, meaningless words that perfectly illustrate what you've laid out above. I guess my pointing out of "architected" as an odd word (and I do not disagree with what scuba_steve_1 said at all) was validation that I've managed to avoid getting sucked into the "buzzword" culture that people have cultivated in my (and other) lines of work that judge your worthiness based on your fancy word usage.

lankysob

@zmd21: @anti-hello-kitty: When was the last time either of you port scanned a fresh windows Box that wasn't built by a big OEM. By default every version of Windows since XP SP2 has had the firewall turned on, and ports closed.

something_unique_and_descriptive

Why wouldn't a hacker want to create a virus that attacks OS X successfully and be the first one to do it? I would think that would be an honored title to receive.

Another Windows virus? Big deal, there are thousands of them. The first widespread OS X virus? Now that would be impressive. All those millions of OS X machines with no anti-virus software on them just, supposedly, waiting to be attacked since the main argument is "small market share" and not OS X's inherent security.

Shabbis

@Qwertyfreak is jumping on the bandwagon:

Im sorry people, but is this guy talking to himself? lol

iFans, Gather behind me.

@Wilson Rothman: And not a day goes by that I don't regret the decision to enter such a profession. ::sigh:: I come to Giz to forget about my job...thanks for reminding me about my job.

lankysob

@cardboredbox: And on Giz no less

something_unique_and_descriptive

@lankysob: Actually, "designed" is okay.

wezelboy

@lankysob: oh god, don't get me started on that fucking architect speak. i went to sci-arc for god's sake--it's even in the name of the school!

and i agree: architected is not the right word. i understand the use of "architect" or "architecture" as applied to software and don't take issue with it, but "architected" is not a real work, and just sounds wrong.

lostarchitect

Well, I've had Macs for the last 10 years and I love them. Actually, my wife wants a new Powerbook G4 12 (the other one had a tragic dead)...

Anyway... I dare you to see Trial by Fire with Tim Ferriss.
Tomorrow at 11PM on History Channel.

miguelggarcia

Virus? Fear not! Virtual Machine is here to assist you.

Undoubtedly

I stopped reading when the bullshit about being inherently more secure popped up. Doesn't anyone remember that little hacker summit that was held to hack each OS? OS X was the first to fall. OS X is not more secure, hackers just don't care about it.

Its another Apple Myth.

jbiller

@Ninja_of_Techno: Yea I hear the secret to Linux's rock solid immunity is in that /tmp/... folder

UnderLoK

That was an excellent read! And, as someone pointed out already, the fact that it was informative without being overtly biased is also awesome.

Is there an "Giz Explains" tag?

DW

@drakino: Hey, great point.

matt buchanan

@Kaiser-Machead: Best comment/reference to The Matrix EVER! You're a clever one.

kzooguy

Lmao, honestly some of the users for each OS have simliar personalities:

Windows: Yea we're all here, join us!

Mac OSX: Smart are we, and sexy as well?

Linux: Screw you all, I run all your servers and do all the dirty work, so bug off..

Honestly, I've used all 3 OS's, I'm happy with all of them, each have pro's and con's.. whats not to say?

OS's are like humans, all of them have mistakes, because they're made by humans! no OS is perfect.

Nickrick2641

@iFans, Gather behind me.: i think you are :D

Nickrick2641

@iFans, Gather behind me.: ....

yea pfft.. um didn't you just read the 8.9% up there, yea, thats OSX... sure its a very clean and neat OS, but it cannot rule on an 8.9% level..

Nickrick2641

I'm not sure exactly how to approach this so I'll just put it out there.

Linux is only secure by limiting access to it. If you are behind a firewall you have no worries what so ever unless you download a bogus tarball or get poisoned and download your updates from a bogus site. If the box is on the net (even with ipchains/tables) or you have ports forwarded to your Linux box to allow access to things like Apache or *ftp or whatever and do not take the extra steps to secure those services your box is as good as owned. There are millions of zombie boxes out there that do nothing but spam exploits to add your box to the list.

While you can't beat Linux for security, IF you are going to run services exposed to the net you do need to know what you're doing to be safe and some silly ip* firewall won't cut it as the service itself needs to be protected. Jail the service, filter the access, block keywords, etc...

UnderLoK

@Shabbis: "Why wouldn't a hacker want to create a virus that attacks OS X successfully and be the first one to do it? I would think that would be an honored title to receive."

I don't think "Prison Bitch" is really a title people are going to go after. It would be a guaranteed ticket to a jail cell with very little reward. The kids who "write" viruses for glory aren't the type that have the ability to do it.

Conceptually it's quite possible, it would be slightly more complicated than writing for XP due to the user controls, but there are a whole handful of exploits to give full root on *nix (which includes Darwin) that, last I knew, had not been patched.

something_unique_and_descriptive

@Shub-Niggurath: On the lip side... when a nasty virus comes out for OSX and Linux (a matter of when, not if... because it WILL eventually) everyone will be caught with their pants down...or the lack of them, by their overconfidence on their beloved OS's.

For us, Windows users, we have so much experience with this crap, we are masters at it already. Having used Windows since 2.0 and never having a single virus, trojan, worm or otherwise, has to count for something....

I wonder how knowlegeable the Geniuses at Apple bars would be when it hits... because if a virus hits you and messes up you web connection to download a cure or messes up the OS so it won't boot, it's not like there's an Apple software store around the corner with all the tools to fix it.
Think about it... you are totally screwed.

aec007

@Ninja_of_Techno:

Yay we have a Linux user too. =)

vgart

@srdailey: hah. I got one from trying to install a pirated copy of macdrive on my boot camp side.

I was kicking myself for that one. so I just wiped the partition and reloaded XP.

LazyPanda

@Mona: and also: get AppZapper. I don't know if it is a 100% solution, but it's better than I could do on my own.

LazyPanda

Pre-Vista windows isn't as wide open as you claim it is. If users aren't signing in as an Administrator for their daily computer tasks, like they're supposed to, the security is just as reliable as Vista.

MajellaCabatan

@aec007: You might be used to viruses, but my Grandma uses a PC and she isn't.

I use a mac and I'm very familiar with viruses from my years on a PC and my use of parallels and bootcamp.

It's got nothing to do with which OS you use, it's just the level of general knowledge.

LazyPanda

@zmd21: Rubbish.
Out of the box, OS X has Bonjour enabled, which makes the box trivial to locate on a network. Disabling Bonjour is a royal pain, not to mention it gets reactivated on updates sometimes. Surprisingly, Windows is actually better in that regard.

codelogic

I have always considered MAC computers to be little more than APPLIANCES.

If your needs are very simple and taillored it might work for you.

If you need raw power and full control of everything at your finger tips, then there is no substitute for a PC running Windows or Linux.

Most MACphiles dont really care about what's running their machines. They just see icons and bouncing balls.

Blaxpear

@Ninja_of_Techno:

Get a better job. Or, maybe do some research and learn that's it's really NOT more expensive, instead of perpetuating this geek myth.

soulfinger

The Mac OS is like a home school kid who doesn't have any friends and doesn't hang out with anyone, he just wears his nice clothes around his pretentious brushed aluminum house. God forbid someone lets him out in public, he thinks everyone is weird and that only he knows how to properly interact with other people.

In reality he's just introverted and awkward to everyone who is used to interacting with other people, though, they do agree that he has a nice outfit on.

I'm sure I could expand upon this further, but I really should do a little bit of work today.

Voyou_Charmant

@zmd21:
Rubbish.
Out of the box, OS X has Bonjour enabled, which makes the box trivial to locate on a network. Disabling Bonjour is a royal pain, not to mention it gets reactivated on updates sometimes. Surprisingly, Windows is actually better in that regard.

codelogic

FAIL,

The security by obscurity rationale described in the first paragraph is not valid, because the article is about whey OSX is less susceptible than Windows. The numbers of systems in use doesn't inherently make one more or less susceptible since vulnerability relates directly to the technical flaws within the system. A virus doesn't understand how many of one system is more or less available than the others therefore chooses to infect or not infect a system.

The other argument would be well, Windows has a larger market so people who create viruses tend to gravitate to where they can cause the most damage.
Double FAIL.

People write viruses and malware for more reasons than profit, one being ego, and who wouldn't want to put the legions of smug-ass Mac users in their place by wreaking havoc on their systems worldwide. Yet, this hasn't happened.

You can't tell me it's because there are fewer targets. It directly relates to effort required to implement, and with OSX it definitely is more difficult.

soulfinger

...most malware writers obviously use Windows.

hnkelley

@iFans, Gather behind me.: It's called a "joke". You should learn to differentiate between jokes and serious discussions.

Qwertyfreak is jumping on the bandwagon

@cardboredbox: standing ovation clap!

Some_F-in-ShiT_Ass

@iFans, Gather behind me.: iTroll be quiet grownups are talking...

Thats Dr Bear to You

@Woden501: oh and "buying in "restricts all of your friends and family from joining, because the gated communities small print reads "mingling restricted to our own only" its the only exclusive cult of the computer world. me? I'm FREE and staying that way

senekerc

OSX is secure by obscurity. That's the fundamental difference. No hacker is going to waste their time writing a virus that the half dozen mac owners are going to see.

diverguy

Sorry, don't know why my reply ended up here.

codelogic

@something_unique_and_descriptive: Seriously I'm impressed! Good job Giz!

AchtungYall

Good article, but why compare Mac OSX to Windows Pre-Vista? Why not OSX vs. Vista? That would be a fairer comparison.

camron9989

Vista AND OS X, FTW.

Vista and OS X sitting on a tree...

vqro

@kevininstereo: Uhh. this was covered the other day. That article was false.

[gizmodo.com]

soopafly

I love the last paragraph...

Polybius

@Kaiser-Machead: Dammit, now every post of yours I read will inherently contain that voice. Even the Matrix one wasn't Smith; it was our friend and pal CBSG.

rcast1986

@SAN66: To make a mac virus you need a mac first.

No real mac hater would go out of their way and buy one just to make a virus, or in any other circumstance really.. :p

shinchan

@soulfinger: It's not more expensive than linux?

Shit, since when's OSX free?

shinchan

You forgot to mention Windows biggest security hole--The Registry.

Vroomtrap

@Shub-Niggurath: If you know how to use a NT-based system you're free from any problems
i never encountered any problems by forcing me to use a limited account and only actions i approve are runned as administrator
Even Windows XP can work that way but sadly the second login sucks

But linux showed how to use an OS run as a user and only some tasks are runned as superuser

TBM-Fan

@thisaintsweettea: I'm hoping more work than went into that "analogy."   ; )

someToast

@Iron Sheep: I agree with Iron Sheep, and to go way, way further... my vista build is perfect. The only thing that doesn't play nice with it is, no surprise here, iTunes.

Why would anyone own an apple when there's Ubuntu? Why? Give me one reason?

I personally love Vista and XP, but really, that's because I like options, software, games, and really EVERYTHING a computer has to offer. Not a marginalized share of it.

PC Tonic

@cardboredbox: Too bad they followed it up with more unnecessary Zune bashing in the Obama post.

Darkest Daze

The marketshare argument is thrown around a lot, but, people who create viruses tend to do it to fuel their own ego/leetness. And I think that the person who could successfully write the first true OS X virus/worm would gain a lot in terms of leetness and in their own ego.

cristiana

@xxjudgmentxx: God luck writing malware for people who use lynx textbased browser to surf the web and look at ascii porn!

shinchan

@camron9989: Vista is nothing short of a failure. When you have people buying salavged PC's to get the previous release of the operating system, that says something to the quality of product released. I hope Microsoft really puts quality into Windows 7. I looked forward to Vista and I still use it, but I am disappointed by it's performance.

Vroomtrap

@shinchan: Plus, any who have have realized how much they actually like OSX and have been with it ever since :)

SoaringDisbelief

Should I say this? Do I dare? I've been using Vista for about a month now on my laptop at home and I like it a lot better than XP. It was a little quirky at first but I've learned to like it. I didn't know the tidbit about it being less vulnerable to viruses than previous versions.

Of course I'm running with 4 gig of RAM, and using most of it even when I'm not pushing it. And the first thing I did when I cranked it up was to install jEdit, Chrome, Winamp, iTunes, and Open Office. Oh, yeah, and most importantly Cygwin.

stryder100

@zmd21: Any Windoze user (i.e. on a non-server computer) who has ports listening outside a firewall are living dangerously to say the least.

stryder100

@iFans, Gather behind me.: Did you happen to read the fact that Windows is installed on 89.6 percent of the world's computers? Good luck ruling with only 8.9%.

dmanbluesfreak

@Qwertyfreak is jumping on the bandwagon: Same goes to those who are harping on iFans... He was telling a joke... 8.9% market share is nothing to laugh about though. It's still growing and shows that Mac adoption is rapidly increasing.

MBPro

@jeremedia:

So what's the difference between helping someone get over their "fear" of software while using a mac or helping someone get over it using a PC?

Arn't you basically cutting them off from the other 89.9% of people out there. It's like teaching someone to be comfortable ridding a scooter when everyone else has cars. They'll never get on the freeway.

RyaninCalgary

@LazyPanda: One of the biggest problems (?) is that with OS X, leftover / hidden files don't effect the performance so I haven't bothered to learn... Not sure if that's a good or bad thing. :|

Mona

This article reinforces the point hugely: [weblog.infoworld.com]

zack13532

@rcast1986: Technically, it wasn't supposed to be Smith anyway :P

Kaiser-Machead

@RyaninCalgary: ??? sooooo, if they have a mac, why do they need to know how to aptly use a PC? Macs are just as good if not better than PCs.

zack13532

@highfloydelity: *Last clap*/Cleveland

The Magnificen7

@dmanbluesfreak: lol, is your sarcasm meter broken?

zack13532

@cardboredbox lol!

Thank you for that well written article. Nice to see a good description about the difference without the flames. Let it ensue in the comments...

buffalo2001

OSX has so many different versions spread across a wide user base. Many new applications support Leopard only, leaving Tiger and below behind. A virus that works on Intel Macs might not work on Power PC macs. Or works in Tiger, but not leopard. And then Snow leopard.

OSX isn't concerned about backwards compatibility, where its far more important in Windows. So while Macs might have 8.9% market share, the number of macs capable of running the virus is probably much less.

SuperSan

@senekerc: On the other hand, unlike MS, Apple doesn't seem to actually care about SN's. Buy one copy and then put it on all your machines. There's not stupid key code like MS and not once have I ever had any issue with a Mac telling me to STFU because I had installed an OS from one DVD on more than one machine. (not including OSX server)

Oldbrass

In the context of my classroom, my students are 100% people switching to Mac from Windows, primarily because they reached an internal hassle threshold with their former Windows box.

The class itself is part of the reason they are switching: a free and useful introduction to actual computer mastery of which there is no Microsoft-provided equivalent.

The class covers primarily universal concepts such as processors, memory, storage, interfaces as visual language, and the dangers of exclusively seeking step-based instruction.

jeremedia

"On the flip side, you're also the first, and best, line of protection. Don't do anything stupid, and you'll be fine, anti-virus software or not-whatever OS you're running."
I agree that the user is the best (or worst) security feature. OTOH, the second part is not exactly true. You can, even if you do everything right, (including what not to do) get hacked. Most of the time not in the traditional sense of your box getting pwnd w/ a typical virus, but there are a lot of other security vulnerabilities, and some are OS agnostic. Agnostic ones: DNS vulnerabilities, weak encryption etc. Also, browser exploits are probably one of the biggest and easiest leaks in any OS and often can trickily get around otherwise sound security. (I think this is especially true for OSX, since hacking it any other way is such a PITA.)
And, not to be alarmist or a harbringer of doom and gloom but, "you" don't have to get hacked anyways, if your /bank/cell carrier/cable co/govt/ database does your fscked any way you slice it.

Just saying, plz be careful.

DarthZigger

I enjoyed the article, however I'm afraid that your argument is slightly flawed. You said that even if Mac OSX was king,

"...if malware acted mostly like it does today, it likely wouldn't have the same impact as it did on Windows pre-Vista.

Well, if Mac was king, then it is likely to assume that malware would have evolved to target the numerous vulnerabilities on the Mac and would therefore NOT act like it does today.

Still, an interesting piece.

nka

@lankysob: 'architected'?

As an actual architect, that makes me cry."

In English, any word can be verbed.

Toysandme

@MBPro: No comment referred to the 8.9% market share thing. Good job.

Qwertyfreak is jumping on the bandwagon

@aec007: Baha, baha, bahAHAAHAHAH. hee.

Like the OSX developers, BSD and Linux kernel hackers, and Linux distro developers don't follow what goes on with Windows malware.

anderlan

A small - but really important nitpick.

NT class Windows (NT/2K/XP/Vista) have a very rich and deep permission model. It has access control lists and roles as well as policy layers that neither MacOS nor Unix/Linux have.

The chief defect hasn't been inherent security - it's a decision that Microsoft finally decided to override with Vista. Until then, the default group for a new user was Administrator. Running as Admin is analogous to running in Unix as root.

This was done for a number of reasons (arguably bad ones), mostly to handle applications that came from Win9x land where there was no real equivalence to an Admin account.

If you take any NT class OS and create ONLY user mode accounts, and apply default network and file access privs, you get a very safe system.

Vista did just that. UAC is an attempt to create an 'admin-like-but-not-really-admin'... user level. This lets badly written apps think they're running as Admin (mostly) while not actually BEING an Admin.

They also fixed one other huge flaw that actually got fixed in WinXP Pro 64: they shut down the patch table.

The best argument against the author's contention is the simplest: at the last BlackHat conference, they put up an out of the box vanilla MacBook, HP laptop running Vista Home Premium and a Dell laptop running Linux (Ubuntu, I think) and the Mac got hacked in a couple hours. The Vist box held out for two days. The Linux box didn't get hacked - but it was also admitted that there was very little interest shown in trying to hack it.

TheWerewolf

The way I'd heard it was that Macs are _more_ susceptible to viruses (due to not really having any need to patch their you-better-believe-they-exist security holes)...but noone writes code for Macs.

Purple Dave

@SpeedyGonzalas: Even better...APPLED!

SpeedyGonzalas

@Toysandme: Englished, grassed, haired,...sure, works for me.

SpeedyGonzalas

@scuba_steve_1: "Bullshit", now there's a word.

SpeedyGonzalas

@soulfinger: You fail:

A virus doesn't understand anything, it's writer does. It's writer also knows Windows is a better shot because so many people use it. If as many virusses existed for OSX the same amount of vulnerabilities would have been exposed.

You fail again:
To program a virus for a Mac you must have knowledge about Macs. How many people are there with knowledge about programming for OSX, and how many are there with knowledge about programming for Windows. Apart from the immense difference in marketshare, there's also an even bigger difference in programmers available, as OSX is as good as useless and financially uninteresting for any businesses other than design/graphics.

So
1. There's an insane number of programmers that can turn to the dark side for Windows against a handful of developers for OSX.
2. Anyone writing a virus wants to do damage. The bigger the marketshare of the OS the bigger the change of succes: OSX is therefore a stupid choice.

Herman

Are you sure we'll be fine? I ran a Windows PC for a little over six months, with no antivirus, only visiting common and popular websites, not even looking at... questionable content. My PC still BSOD'd on startup every single time after those six months. I'm never going back to Windows.

DJP3DRO

@Qwertyfreak is jumping on the bandwagon: Your kind is pathetic. You look for ways to incite arguments.

Is it that time of the month for you or do you have a flag pole up your ass?

MBPro

@someToast: I found the analogy rather humorous.

Kosmose

@Qwertyfreak is jumping on the bandwagon: Thanks. That was me adding my opinion but way to look for something to troll about. Asshat.

MBPro

@Kaiser-Machead: ... and then you have to reboot in order to reinitialize...

ideaman2020

@MBPro: Me trolling? Wow, you are an idiot. You were the one that brought that piece of information up, obviously looking for a fight. Not only that, but that fact had no place in this discussion. If you really wanted to add you opinion, you could have done it elsewhere. No need to respond to anyone here. I would have given you the benefit of the doubt, but you prior comments have made it clear you are blind, one-sided lover of Apple.
And please, try refrain yourself from talking about my ass. Thanks.

Qwertyfreak is jumping on the bandwagon

@Voyou_Charmant: Interesting analogy. In some ways that is what I get from my understanding of how OS X works. I think it is further curious that the users are inherently the opposite, in reference to both OS X and "everyone else"

MrHaroHaro

@cardboredbox:

haha yea, at least its not ANOTHER flame-war :D

SMART599

The idea that Mac OS is made secure by it's obscurity only makes sense to people with no awareness of the history of the Mac OS. Prior to having a Unix based OS Mac OS had plenty of viruses. OS X is safer because of its unix roots which apparently you don't know enough about to comment on. Your rationale makes even less sense when you consider that someone who wrote a successful virus for OS X would get far more notice than yet another script kiddie virus on Windows.

LaceyTiamat

@imTheKing: I'm sorry, but what in the blazes does "consumer the comments" mean? Or was that part of you l33t speak impression...?

SleepingPanda

@Qwertyfreak is jumping on the bandwagon: Well said qwertyfreak, well said

Etaripamai (XBL)

for as long as i have used a computer, i have never used an anti-virus. Just like the end of the article says, "don't be stupid" and you'll be fine.

chigga

@Etaripamai (XBL): Why thank you.

Qwertyfreak is jumping on the bandwagon

@lankysob: i think i should also point out that in software, there is a difference between an "architecture", a "design" and an "implementation". Architecture refers to the abstract associativity between modules of the system. It's similar to if you were creating a building complex and you had an abstract plan that said what kinds of building would exist there, the purpose for each building, and how the buildings would be connected. The desig