Ugh. I gave up my 30g Zune for an iPod Touch. I did like the Zune a lot, and maybe if I had the 80 instead of the 30 I would have kept it. But 2.3 just came out, and that broke the Zune.

I did like the software though. It was AWESOME.

So....I'm never looking back. Though I sometimes get dreams...

bana

@Dooosh: Out of the past 35 posts by Giz, only 3 were Apple related whatsoever.

Go whine elsewhere

Jon B.

Installing it now! Zune FTW!

jhoeforth

@Dooosh: You're just asking to get banned.

Jon B.

@hammertime1994:

8gb and 16gb only :(

Cursemaster0

Drool... What's with the blue Zunes on the website, I'll take 2 in 120GB.

hammertime1994

"page cannot be found" :-(

Der182

@OMG! Apple Stinks!:
Why is everyone so upset with the ToS not being online?

sugardeath

@DW:

I second this.

Just not the CS3 part.....

Cursemaster0

@DW: The Zune interface blows the hell out of the iTunes interface. Cupertino can stand to learn something from it.

ToS is still not online yet. And it's irksome. Not on the iTunes 8 level of irksome, but irksome nonetheless.

OMG! Apple Stinks!

@Dooosh:

Well something finally broke through!

:D

Cursemaster0

Wait I thought this was a Mac Only site?

Dooosh

Yeah, ToS is a bit wonky but Updating was fine.

Skeezy

Yeay! I got the new software. One problem

-You can't get to the new ToS yet....

So not real updates yet. Now playing is amazing. Zune,ftw!

Cursemaster0

I don't have a Zune, but I would like to ask a question:

Who does the animations and motion graphics for Zune? They are absolutely incredible!!!

And the one on the home page of their site is so freaking cool that it makes me want to bust out my Adobe CS3 and try to re-create it.

DW

Argh! Why am I studying for a chem exam in my friend's room with my Linux-only laptop! D: I am so pumped for this for some reason...

sugardeath

@Jon B.: When the new ipod event was being held, there were over 24 posts of virtually solid apple coverage. About 2 posts on the zune and new software. Of those 24 posts, about 20 of them were redundant.

Aturayd

@smackswell: I don't like either the Zune or iPod but the Zune does play AAC files...just not the DRM infected iTunes type.

Kspraydad

I just downloaded this software solely on the strident recommendation of OMG! Apple Stinks!. Such is the power of the stars.

HonusWScruggs

@smackswell: Nice FUD. Except that the Zune software will play AAC (m4a) files just fine. Anything you ripped in iTunes can be played in Zune software. The only things you can't play are protected AAC files.

I'm listening to the Beatles right now, which I ripped earlier this year using iTunes - which was my default player/ripper. Until now.

Is this thing going to kill the iPod? No. But I bet Sansa is shitting bricks right now. This is some of the best software I've seen in ages and is a jukebox program on the same level as iTunes (and better than 8)

OMG! Apple Stinks!

@smackswell:
I tried the browser on the zune and it sucked balls. Well, I couldn't find it. So I assume it sucks balls.
What? Browser? To browse music? It's the main music tab.

What do you mean there's no browser? Is there a place to get apps for my zune? Wait what? Is there at least a calculator? NO? Games maybe? Huh.
Apps? This is a music player, it's purpose is to play music. Games? They're coming, actually.

Alright. Whatever. I'll use it for all the music I bought on the world's biggest music store. Um, are you trying to tell me this doesn't work with aac music files?
How often are competeing services compatible?

So why am I supposed to buy this thing?
Because you're not a tool? Oh wait.

..sorry, I'm a sucker for trolls.

sugardeath

I tried the browser on the zune and it sucked balls. Well, I couldn't find it. So I assume it sucks balls.

What do you mean there's no browser? Is there a place to get apps for my zune? Wait what? Is there at least a calculator? NO? Games maybe? Huh.

Alright. Whatever. I'll use it for all the music I bought on the world's biggest music store. Um, are you trying to tell me this doesn't work with aac music files?

So why am I supposed to buy this thing?

smackswell

@bana: I have both also and the zune 30 gig has much better sound quality then the ipod touch does so when it comes to actually listening to music I use my zune. I use my touch for everything but music .

majortom1029

Seriously - I've never seen anything as fascinating as MixView. I'm astounded by it. Vista owners - download the software.

OMG! Apple Stinks!

@sugardeath: You need to click the new ToS to access the Social. But you can already MixView. It's SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO much better than Genius.

OMG! Apple Stinks!

Did anyone manage to get Audible Books to work yet? Anyone see where I could do that? Audible software doesn't recognize the Zune (yet).

CineKal

@alcyone: No.

Kspraydad

@Drvec: it is very sweet. I am loving this update. The free games on the zune are great too. I'll be playing those on the bus later today.

egyptomix

So, can you sync your iPod with the Zune Software?

alcyone

Did anyone mention the music visualization pumping from the orange/pink bar at the bottom? It looks uber cool.

Drvec

@OMG! Apple Stinks!: They play aac?

Oops. Epic fail. Zune scores one.

I like fishing. With all the rabid anti-apple fanatics that creep out of the woodwork on iPod posts I thought I'd snag a couple on their home turf.

smackswell

The ToS is working now!

Also, it seems they've removed the country restrictions, I used to have to use a proxy to create an account and accept updated ToS from Aus, now it just signs in no prob.

This is awesome!

Drvec

@calpis: Is the "bug" automatic or is there a setting for this, I never had the software when this was in there but not being able to do this is the one thing that has just drove me nuts

Also, @DW: the new ad on zune.net is awesome

@alcyone: 41.5MB, and it runs much smoother than iTunes for me with a large library (47K songs) which is one of the reasons I went with the zune over the iPod

theweerdough

Just installed and even got past the ToS. I'm really liking the new update so far. They also reinstated the "bug" in the podcasts section so it can finally download all new and unplayed podcasts and would delete already played ones. That makes me happy.

Some other minor tweaks done to the actual zune's settings like, added additional options for touch pad and on screen clock.

calpis

@Kspraydad:
So, downloading this wouldn't make much sense if I had an iPod? Although I'm inclined to test this.

How large is this prog BTW.

alcyone

If I could connect online, I'd be upgrading my Zune 80 right now...stupid firewall at work...:( Have played with 3.0 software, though. I really like it, I just wish they had added the EQ to the software, and not just the device.

Sgt. Bilbo

<3 my Zune even more now. Browsing the Marketplace and sampling songs all from the device rocks. Added a clock... but don't see sleep or alarm functionality.... sooo... what's the point of a clock? MixView rocks. Can't wait to get home to test it out for fixes to metadata issues.

triggerx

@OMG! Apple Stinks!:

does the zune play flac?
tia

godwhacker

Nobody has mentioned that Microsoft is also offering a free 14 day Zune Pass subscription trial timed with the new update. I bet they will get a lot of paid subs now once people get to fully appreciate stuff like Buy from FM, Channels and Mixview.

mrweatherbee

@alcyone: The download and install are quick. Quicker than iTunes 8. Plus, it's "no-risk". You don't need to tell the program to import your library and doesn't make you convert it either.

You tell it where the music is and in the background it does everything for you. It's an example of how a program should work. Between Microsoft's history of bloat and Apple's current fumble, this thing is refreshing.

Install it - it won't move your files. Use it and give the features a whirl. If you don't like it, uninstall it. No harm.

OMG! Ponies!

@godwhacker:
oops, that question is for ponies and anyone who owns a zune

godwhacker

i just got done converting my collection to flac (much time was spent), and reconverting it for my sansa is ok for now, i'd rather be able to use what i have on my machine straight up.

so tell me, is the zune worth it? i would never buy tunes from the store, and i like to make my own playlists. given that, is it different/good enough to change to?
i bought my sansa refurbed, so cash isn't an issue. i
can just throw it out in the garage for use there.

godwhacker

I tried to install it twice from the Website and it failed both times. I ended up having to go to the MS help page and downloading the package from MS Download Center. Not sure if that's a good sign.

tasselhoff76

@godwhacker: Not yet. But if Microsoft put it in a future version, given their track record, I think that everyone would get it across the board.

Wow. Now Microsoft has a track record for not dicking over existing customers.

Hey Beelezebub - up for some ice fishing?

OMG! Apple Stinks!

updating now

ZetaCrossfire

@Argo117: Terms of Service.

OMG! Apple Stinks!

K guys, this is embarrassing for me since I am a HUGE Zuner, but what does ToS mean?

Argo117

@godwhacker: I haven't gotten my Zune yet, although I did order one based in part on the death of my girlfriend's iPod classic, which died of the same "Power Connector Syndrome" that killed my iPod classic, and in part based on the strength of the Zune software. iTunes is just too bloated.

This software does a lot of really good things. The first thing it did right was not "import" my library. The fact that if I don't like it I can just take it off made the software a must-try. And having just spent a full week with iTunes 8 (and years with iTunes in general), the difference was night and day. I'm still using iTunes to update some tags and album covers but Zune recognizes the changes immediately.

Don't get me wrong - I still need iTunes because I have an iPhone. But as far as switching is concerned, Microsoft learned from Apple. It's the software, stupid.

Think of Microsoft as a Terminator. It's a learning machine. It sees what others are doing, integrates it, and learns from its mistakes. Microsoft never aims for the top spot when it's moving into new territory and this shows that Microsoft is trying to position itself to overtake Sansa.

Look at the XBox. Microsoft knew that it wouldn't beat Sony out of the gate. It never aimed for the Number One spot; it gunned for Number 2. It saw that it needed exclusive games and a killer app that set it apart. It also capitalized on its competition's errors. It wouldn't be Number 2 if Nintendo hadn't botched the Gamecube.

Now look at the Zune - MixView isn't necessarily a killer app. Zune Pass may be. And Apple quality control and consumer friendliness is slipping. I think that the new iPod lineup represents a shift away from the Mac Faithful and towards a "quick buck" mentality. The two major iPod feature additions have been gimmicks - Coverflow (useless on a classic) and ShakeShuffle. What Apple didn't put in was a radio or Nike+.

The disposable iPod may cost Apple in the end. Which is why Microsoft is building a loyal fanbase.

OMG! Apple Stinks!

@godwhacker:
I personally bought my Zune because I prefer the interface to all the other players. I use a Zune 80 (Hard Disk - not flash). Still have to baby it a bit, just like other HDD units. I've been using since Zune 2.2 and I can honestly say that MS has been doing some great things with this player.

With that said, I recommend going to Best Buy, Fry's, Target, or just about any other place to try before you buy. Make sure you like the interface. It's less iPod-ish than the Sandisk units I've tried.

And to answer your questions about the playlists - The Zune software will open any .m3u files you have in your music directory, which most players use for playlists. You can create your own, or you can use the autoplaylist function, much like with iTunes.

Hope that answers your questions.

jduke882

Finished the update. Freaking sweet.

Off to kill my battery cranking Avenged Sevenfold and playing Poker. When I should be working mind you.

Oh, Zune... your so worth it though.

ViperBorg

Buried in all the 3.0 update is the fact that Audible support is now official. Can't be synced through the Zune software unfortunately, you have to use Audible Manager, but this was previously a deal breaker for plenty of folks who griped that the Zune was one of the only PMPs that didn't support Audible content.

[audible.custhelp.com]

mrweatherbee

@Argo117: What is more embarassing is that you just described yourself as a "Zuner." ;-)

mrweatherbee

@godwhacker: No, but it does support WMA Lossless.
While it may be a pain to convert FLAC to WMA Lossless, it's two different lossless technologies...so really, no harm done.

Fifth Echo

A clock, finally thank you, seriously that should have come out on the first version.

lilkeith7

My Zune's awesome! love it... but i'm bummed since the social is unavailable to those overseas, aaaaand i can't for the life of me figure how to get .avi files on it. Bummer.

twreckx

So... Unicode? Unicode? yes yes? or still no?

Fused7

got the new software

uses 99% CPU

and over 100,000K MEM USAGE

did i do something wrong?

mrpedenman

@jduke882:
@Fifth Echo:
@OMG! Ponies!:

thanks for the input, i am not a portable hard drive guy(has to be motorcycle-proof), so i would be in for the solid state version.
i will give it consideration and see if i can find one to play with out in the wild.
thanks again

godwhacker

Can ANYONE tell me ifthey put in unicode support?

Fused7

@mrpedenman: "uses 99% CPU"

Everytime I've updated Zune software, it has to gyrate for a bit on first launch.

Once the 3.0 gyration stopped, I found that it used way less resources than before. Speed is much better too.

Something to look at: the preference for auto updating album art and metadata, especially if your library is fairly large. I found that option to be a hog...and since I only add "squared away" mp3's to my library (thank you MediaMonkey) I disable it for a peppier zune experience.

So far, I'm happy with the 3.0 update. I hope the iPod users have good experiences with their new updates too. There's room for both.

stratboy

omg, we get games and a CLOCK!! scuse me while I clean up. :)

supercrap

@stratboy:

thanks for the tips

i installed 3.0 on a machine that hadnt had any Zune software ever and it is also a machine that has only 1 album on it.

mrpedenman

Audible now has the plugin available for The Zune.

CineKal

@theweerdough: Set your "Episodes" to "keep all..." and "Syncing" to "...all unplayed and partially played". This will delete all fully played podcasts off your zune and your computer. If you want to keep any episodes, just right click it and "add to collection".

@Fused7: No unicode support on the player yet.

calpis

Dropped the update on this morning. Spent the half hour or so subway commute listening to ESPN Radio and playing Texas Hold 'Em. It's a first generation (I got it for free from Microsoft's little casual game site - the best thing to ever happen to a crossword junkie), so I imagine the games are a little better if you have a wheel instead of a pad, but it certainly helped the time go.

MixView seems really cool. I only messed with it for a couple minutes, and learned a few things about some of my favorite artists. The only thing that seemed a little off - that James Taylor album referenced above. I saw that as a related album for three (very) different artists - Barenaked Ladies, Billy Joel and Reel Big Fish. I have to wonder if "related" means "we want you to buy it this week." But hey, could do worse than James Taylor.

The other thing that seems cool that no one seems to be talking about is channels. For that one, you do have to have a pass for unlimited downloads (I don't), but I browsed what my channel would have been. Basically, it throws together 20 or 25 songs that listeners with habits similar to yours are also listening to that you aren't. It sounds like that's a little closer to the functionality of the iTunes Genius sidebar, at least. It was nice to see that the channel it put together for me wasn't all new crap they were trying to push, but a nice mix of things from all over the place - I had Beck, Hootie & the Blowfish, Coldplay, Mighty Mighty Bosstones, Katy Perry (OK, that one was odd)... a little bit of everything, which matches my tastes well.

Considering I got a 30GB Zune for free, Apple would have to offer something of equal or greater insanity for me to ever switch, but like the rest of the universe, I use iTunes as a store - I would use Zune, but it irks me that you can't just buy songs with real cash money... you have to buy "Microsoft points" first. That aside, the interface is much better and more pleasant to look at. I always thought, even pre-MixView, that the recommendations off of Zune were better than iTunes. But maybe it's just me.

pnguinms

@calpis:
no unicode certainly puts a damper on things, half my songs are just empty square blocks still :(

all i ask for is unicode and a auto shut off function and the zune would be so perfect

Fused7

I'm loving the new update (especially the clock) but I have to say that using the wireless for Marketplace is decimating my zune30's battery.

Its exciting to see the zune get some recognition lately. Hopefully they'll have awesome sales this Christmas. $80 30gig ftw.

winterorchid

3.0 is an improvement. Still better than iTunes.

It - and iTunes - still lack important features.

How do I list files by composer? Let's say I want to listen to "something composed by Mahler"? Ok, make an "automatic" playlist. Do that for a zillion composers?

Or how about browsing like this:
Bach -> J.S. -> Goldberg Variations -> Gould -> First Recording.
Nope.

(explanation: There is more than one composer named Bach, hence the J.S. qualifier. Many performers have recorded the Goldberg variations. Gould has two amazing recordings of it; one as a kid an another as an adult)

That's said the zune player still sounds better for orchestral music than the iPod. The sounds is why I bought the zune in the first place. That should be criterion number 1. It's funny how many people never mention the quality of the sound and concentrate on things like "ooo. we got this new button!" or "It sucks because it doesn't clean out my cat's litterbox"

I checked out the new iPods this weekend so no improvement on their part in the sound department. But they have improved their demo playlist to include classical music rather than the usual music-industry-marketing-tools.

rockhopper

Quite frankly, this software is worthless.

I've owned the 80GB Zune since December of last year. During that time I've learned to only hook up my Zune to my computer if the battery needs charging. That's a bit of an exaggeration, but there's no denying that the dumbed-down interface Microsoft elected to use is infuriating.

So when I had a break between classes today I downloaded the new software, hoping for something remotely worthwhile. Among the many, many problems I have with the software, the single biggest one remains the inconsistency. It repeatedly hangs up while editing track information, uses massive amounts resources, and randomly syncs constantly, even though nothing has been updated and it just did a full sync 45 seconds ago.

The track info editing is still entirely useless. The menus aren't always clear enough as to what you're editing (perhaps because there are 3 ways to edit, none of which work well). My biggest issue with the zune has always been the blackhole otherwise known as "Unknown Artist."

Say you want to listen to a Zeppelin track. You go down to Led and start playing "Ramble On." Then you go play around with settings or look through other artists for a little while. The easiest way to return to the artist page at this point is to press back until the Now Playing screen comes up. Click the center button, select "Go to Artist".... And you're taken to the Unknown Artist section, despite the fact that you found the track under "Led Zeppelin." As if that weren't enough of a bug, if you hit back and go back to the artist list, you're still in the L's with Zep highlighted. Well this time around you can actually edit the information to prevent that from happening. Except you can't.

The previous software was difficult to use when it came time to edit the metadata, but the new one is on a whole different playing field. When I tried to finally organize my Zune I lumped together the albums here and there, and then added artists to those tracks that didn't (or in some cases DID) have artists. Except now I can find said tracks both under the actual artist as well as Unknown Artist.

I give up. Microsoft, you dropped the ball on this one.

Perhaps if they'd spent more time on, say, the core of the software, instead of making sure that I had Facebook on my mp3 player, I wouldn't be so hacked off.

chwatson