@ The Magnificen7:

Actually when an ad gets talked about this much it IS a success. The fact that even people who vehemently hate the ad (i.e. YOU) take the time to discuss it then it has done it's job.

An ad merely asks that you be aware of a certain product, no one of even moderate intelligence would really make a switch based solely on an ad. Much like having Britney doesn't really make you feel any different about what Pepsi tastes like.

The fact is these ads are so talked about that Gizmodo's posts on them have some the highest hit counts around. This campaign is already a success no matter how you spin it.

ToyHammer

no matter how much giz gets from Slob jobs..lol

jae_mez

they are good ads. period

jae_mez

The only question that an advertiser wants answered is:
"Are people talking about the ad?"
Whether you are for or against it, if you're talking about it, the ad was successful.

Quasi_Mojo

well the seinfeld ones were god-awful. good job dumping them, but why didn't they realize that before they aired? the only person in the world less funny that bill gates is jerry seinfeld (if he has no larry david behind him, making him funny).

but i think the new ads, the "*I'm* a pc." ads, are very clear and are the perfect counter to the apple ads.

manyou07

Also, the people who think that because MS is being talked about, that it shows some kind of success, are morons. People are talking about it, but only because they are terrible, and nobody has any interest in the brand. Epic fail, MS.

The Magnificen7

The one thing wrong with the newest batch (everything was wrong with the Seinfeld ads) is that they missed the point of what the Get a Mac commercials are. They have characters playing the actual machines, not the people using them. Absolute bullshit advertising from MS.

They can try to lampoon Apple, but they are really just reminding people why the Apple ads are so good. The MS guys hate them, Apple guys love them (because the MS guys hate them) and the people who have no allegiance see the point, and are most likely to switch. I can't wait to see what Apple does in response.

The Magnificen7

They can't even innovate when they advertise!

altus

I like the new Microsoft ads, all of them, and I don't give a damn what "advertising pros" think of them.

I especially don't care when they are at the Vanity Fair website in difficult-to-read fake Windows prompts.

regnez

true

killermicrobe

@ToyHammer: Actually, NO.

The ad is being talked about on GIZMODO and other COMPUTER websites. They would (and do) talk about crazy Japanese sex toys... does that mean they're a success too?

NOBODY I have ran into on campus or classes has talked about the ads. I'm in two different advertising classes and we haven't talked about this ad, but we have learned enough to know that this isn't a successful ad. It's like the ad company they hired (unless it's in-house, which I wouldn't doubt) thought they were being witty, when they really weren't. Their goal was to counteract the "Get A Mac" ads and they did not do that.

When people watch an Apple Mac ad they feel like they would enjoy a Mac and want one. When people see the MS Windows ad they just get the message that "everyone is doing it, you should too!" and we all know that that is a very weak argument/selling tool. I'm sure yall have all tried that one with your parents now/back in the day and didn't have it end too successful. Well, that's what MS is doing here... making an(other) unsuccessful ad.

I'd discus more but it's 3:50am and I got my advertising class in a few hours and need sleep. Maybe we'll talk about the "I'm A PC" ad and I'll have more to talk about it.

ttech10

incredibly poignant that the microsoft ads are a cheap knock off, clawing desperately for cool-by-association points. Either unfunny meaninglessness, or relying entirely on a competitors campaign to establish any context at all.

rudeadly

am I the only that thought they were good.
they showed many different people with different jobs
in different parts of the earth
not only does it represent how many Windows users there are, but also the good things about PC.

br4nd0n

as a former PC user, i'd have to say this "i'm a PC" ad is the most poignant:

+ Watch video

RoscoPeeholePain

@ToyHammer: No, it's a failure. One of the biggest misconceptions abut the advertising industry is that 'any buzz is good buzz.' Wrong. The MS ads so far have only convinced people that they are completely at a loss compared to Apple. All it does is remind them of Apple, which is free (good) publicity for a competitor.

People are discussing them because they think they suck. And they do. I never said ads were making people switch, but they certainly make them think and take the time to check the product out. The MS ads don't do this. The Pepsi ad is a bad comparison. That was for show. This is geared towards recovering customers, and it won't do that.

Simply put, the campaign is a failure. A $300 million waste that could have been spent on actually making the product more appealing. Instead, they disconnect with their audience (first Seinfeld ad), miss the meaning of the competitors ads (current 'I'm a PC' ads) and make the average American look incredibly stupid (Mojave).

Microsoft doesn't need brand recognition, they need brand acceptance. This does neither.

The Magnificen7

@br4nd0n: You don't think Mac users are the same? The point of these ads were to take on the Get a Mac ads, which show two characters, one playing a Mac, not a Mac user, and the other playing a Windows PC, not a Windows PC user. MS didn't get this.

The Magnificen7

@ToyHammer: That's the only thing these ads have accomplished, is getting people to talk about the ads. Most people don't understand what the ads are trying to accomplish, but it sure is getting a discussion going.

d3bruts1d

@br4nd0n: Just because lots of different people use something doesn't make it good. Hell, lots of people use cocaine.

Sure, the "I'm a PC" ads are far better than the Seinfeld spots but they don't touch the Apple ads or even the HP "The computer is personal again..." ads.

d3bruts1d

@The Magnificen7: Or have a beard. Or study law. I could go on.

The Magnificen7

@ttech10:

Really? When I watch a Mac ad I want to punch that smug Mac git's lights out.

Bottom line is this - MS had an eight point positive shift in public perception after the Seinfeld ads, the purpose of which were to get people talking in time for the more direct Phase 2 ads. CPB know what they're doing. That's why they are where they are.

Drummer_Boy

@Altdotweb: No. A PC does not sell fish. A user does. MS had users, like it or not. It was poorly defined, and could be argued either way, but leans more towards users.

The Magnificen7

@The Magnificen7:

Same personification in both ads

Insert any figure from the MS ad into the Apple ad and you get the same, "I'm a PC" statement, but different definitions.

That's why the MS commercial starts with the stereotype and debunks it.

Altdotweb

@d3bruts1d: Not really MEANING anything though...

The Magnificen7

But, at the end of the day, the business truism still holds true:

"Nobody ever got fired for buying Microsoft"

OMG! Ponies!

Funny, has anyone ever seen a good Hilton, Chase or Gillette commercial?

That company's opinion is not valid at all.

I agree with the writer, this should have been asked to the creative people and and not a C.E.O trying to cheaply promote his company.

FYI : I have no connection to Microsoft, except for the O.S. : )

mhatti3000

Of course, looking at the ad agencies they're quoting, they kind of fall into the "who the hell are they?" category whilst separate research showed an eight point positive shift in public perception and that two-thirds of forum posts were favourable to the Seinfeld campaign.

Oh yeah, and there's a third one in the can ready for release when Phase 2 ends.

The bottom line is this: MS and CPB don't give a fuck what a few Mac fanboys think because they're not the target audience. That would be Joe Public who, it seems, is broadly receptive to the ads and who is now being influenced further by the Phase 2 ads because they relate to what he/she does rather than the caperings of some slacker hipster or some falsely stereotyped buffoon.

If the whole point of the campaign is just to make people aware of the amount of smack talk and, frankly, utter bollocks, Apple have been spreading about MS - and doesn't it say something when your entire campaign is about what your competitor allegedly can't do rather than what you can - then it'll have been worthwhile.

Drummer_Boy

@Drummer_Boy: So what is MS up to? -2?

The Magnificen7

@Drummer_Boy:
If you are a company with what you think is a great product, but low market penetration, then yes, getting people talking about your ads is the aim of an ad.
Microsoft, however, already has penetration - in fact most people just have to bend over and take whatever microsoft brings out next, unless they want to change their hardware.

Lipstick on a pig, anyone?

tarzan69

@OMG! Ponies!: That could no longer be a truism in the not so distant future. But you are right. For now.

The Magnificen7

@Drummer_Boy: What forums are you reading where the Seinfeld ads came off as positive?!?

That public perception swing is deceiving. Nobody has asked since ... when? When was the last time Microsoft was relevant in an advertising realm? Nobody cares about Microsoft, there is almost zero loyalty there. Where are they relative to Apple? Or HP? Or even Viagra???

The Apple ads are mostly about what the Mac can do, some of what Vista can't or doesn't do well. Seems like a solid plan to me. Hardly 'bollocks.'

And the people who are criticizing the ads aren't just Fanboys, they are (like me) advertising students, (like me) people who think critically and (like me) people who know that these ads will have no lasting effect, and the money spent should have been put to better use.

The Magnificen7

@The Magnificen7:

The studies were the ones reported in the NYT. I believe Giz cross references the articles in one of their topics.

The surveys were:

1) From YouGovPolimetrix - "On Sept. 4, when the teaser ads started, the "buzz" about Microsoft was 25 percent positive and 13 percent negative, Mr. Marzilli said, and by Tuesday it was 28 percent positive and 8 percent negative. Microsoft "has been beat up pretty badly by the Apple advertisements in the last six months," he said. "These are strong numbers, good numbers, for Microsoft."

2) From Zeta Interactive - "... (they) found what was described as overwhelmingly positive buzz surrounding Microsoft from Sept. 3 through Monday.

Of the posts analyzed by Relevant Noise during that stage of the teaser campaign, 63 percent were characterized as positive and 37 percent as negative."

So the sample was over the period the ads ran.

Of course, I appreciate this is just one source so if you have any research that counters the point rather than, say, anecdotal statements I'd be glad to see it. That way we can judge if the money could actually have been put to better use.

As for the PC vs Mac ads. Really? I think you're stretching the point there.

Drummer_Boy

@tarzan69:

Oh right. So there aren't any other choices aside from MS then that people can compare Windows against, make an informed decision and then buy the one they want?

Oh wait, there are. And, hey, Linux runs on the same hardware too!

The point is the adverts worked. You may not like but no-one really cares about that.

Drummer_Boy

@The Magnificen7:

Why don't you go find out yourself, cowboy?

Drummer_Boy

Microsoft advertising so you know they're there is like the Bible advertising so you know it's there. If you DON'T, then you've been living in a village of grass huts in the jungle where there is no electricity. Or Christians. Point being, the ads do nothing to tell me why MS is a better choice than OS X or Linux. They show me that Bill Gates and Seinfeld can be awkward. I know some people are amused by them. Fine. But the point of an ad for a name as well known as Microsoft is to sell something, right? If there wasn't a Windows Logo with "Vista" next to it at the end, I wouldn't have known what the ad was for. It's just like ads for feminine hygiene products, genital warts treatments and bad 80's black-and-white perfume ads. 99% of the ad has nothing to do with the product, and half the time you don't know what that is in the end.

OneMHz

@The Magnificen7: Indeed, that is true. But someday it might not be true anymore.

92BuickLeSabre

@Drummer_Boy: At least in the posts at these sites, the negative rate has been closer to 80 or 90%. Don't bring up fanboys.

I'd love to see the parameters that exist for positive and negative for these surveys. Wow. 25% positive and 13% negative? So 62% didn't care? I'm sure the positive numbers for Apple would be much higher. I'm willing to bet that positive means anything from 'that was great' to 'it wasn't the worst.' Negative is very defined as 'that was terrible.' Misleading numbers. 37% negative is a huge number for such an important campaign.

There is nothing conclusive here, it's still all relative. I am positive the money could have been put to better use, maybe used to account for these faults, maybe make sure Windows 7 isn't a massive cluster-fuck of bad press? Vista is beyond redemption.

I'm curious to hear a reason for you saying I'm 'stretching the point' on the Mac ads. They are certainly very effective. You've even said it yourself, that MS was beaten up by those ads. They still will be when Apple continues to release ads, which I would imagine could include a direct response ad to these that absolutely slams MS. Then we'll see where the numbers are.

And besides the point, even if in some magical dream world, that this boosts Vista, what happens when people get it home and have problems? This is where MS should be spending money. Microsoft isn't used to competition, and now that they are being thrashed by Apple, they scramble and release these. If that isn't the biggest indication of the trouble Microsoft is in, I don't know what is.

The Magnificen7

because Windows is complex and difficult to use??

axed

@Quasi_Mojo: What about the question 'is it selling the product we were paid to help sell?'

The Magnificen7

@OneMHz: See, this is what the majority seem to be thinking. "Oh, ha ha, they're eating churros and shaking their butts. Wait, what the fuck was that? Who cares."

The Magnificen7

@92BuickLeSabre: If that day comes, it will much further on. And I would welcome it. If I were alive. I can see Ponies' truism being false within my lifetime, easily.

The Magnificen7

@Drummer_Boy:

"The bottom line is this: MS and CPB don't give a fuck what a few Mac fanboys think because they're not the target audience."

Then why run a campaign which, according to most reports, is entirely based on correcting the misconceptions of the Apple ads?

rattyuk

@mhatti3000: Maybe not, but I've seen good ads for Nike, Volkswagen, Discover, American Express, Absolut Vodka and Nestle. The companies that made those ads all hated the MS ads.

The Magnificen7

I love the fact that Mac ads directly attack PCs, while MS ads just talk about themselves. They don't even mention Macs. They don't attack macs, they just work on their own image. Sooo...

Mac ads talk about: PCs
MS ads talk about: PCs

Looks like there are two big entities out there getting the word out on PCs.

Remember in 2004 when Kerry was anti-Bush, and Bush was pro-Bush? Yeah, Bush won. Mac needs to tout its own strengths before they will grab a significant share of the market, instead of focusing on PC's flaws. And Macs have some huge strengths. I want to see them stop running attack ads.

closhedbb

@The Magnificen7: The trick is to come out with an OS that is supported by a wide range of cheap, customizable hardware which is scaleable and has a large pool of IT workers trained on both the system and the hardware, coupled with a large base of software and universality of end-users trained on the software.

What does Microsoft do right? Office. With the exception of the radical UI change in Office 2007, the worker pool knows Office and is comfortable with Office.

Additionally, large implementations of Windows can be customized to allow varying degree of access to programs. I've seen networks that only allow access to the Office suite and I've seen ones that allow total access to all programs on Windows. If you don't want idiot users installing Weatherbug and Webshots, take away install privileges. With a good IT department, Windows is cost-effective.

Microsoft did a few things right business-wise. During the late Eighties, Microsoft made Windows 3.x dirt-cheap. If you bought a mouse, it came with a licensed copy of Windows. The home user became familiar with Windows on a day-to-day basis.

Microsoft focused on the business users. The business market is huge and Microsoft spent the Nineties locking it down.

Microsoft largely turns a blind eye to piracy of its software in non-Western countries. India and China pirate Windows at an enormous rate. Microsoft's response was to lower the price to meet that market and otherwise not crack down too much on the remaining piracy. If some kid in India wants to use a gray or black-market copy of Windows to train on, that's fine. He'll wind up a Windows user at the end of the day. On the other hand, Microsoft does crack down on US businesses that use unlicensed copies. That detracts from the bottom line without giving anything in return.

If Apple had done a better job with the business market and with networking in the Nineties, it could have been in Microsoft's shoes. As for Linux, people don't know it and it causes reticence for that reason.

OMG! Ponies!

You know what it really is. Microsoft sells software. They are not a PC, they are the OS. Apple sells a lifestyle, much like Harley Davidson does. It's not just about the computer it's about the whole thing.

WilCon

I think the new Microsoft ads (I'm a PC) fail in that they just reinforce the Mac ads by imitating them. They should just stick with the BG and Seinfeld ads, just keep it different.

RE-L

@ToyHammer:

"An ad merely asks that you be aware of a certain product"

Oh I think plenty of people are aware of the "product" (=Vista). They just don't like it ;-p So the goal of these ads should be trying to change that perception. If they fail to do that, then the ad is a failure.

Dearhaw

@tarzan69: Woah, woah! No need to make sexist comments!

rjp

@rudeadly: Apple fanboy are we, I am not a huge fan of the new commercials, nor am I a fan of the mac commercials, those are just fucking moronic, honestly, can they not sell their product based on it's own merits? Instead of you know, just insulting someone else? Of course you need the other commercials for context, honestly, were someone insulting you, would you not insult them back, would anyone around, not possibly need to have been there to have heard the other insults to have some understanding of why you are insulting them?

DozeUser

@ToyHammer: Uh, no. The campaign is an abject failure specifically because people are talking about the ads. An ad can be called successful if it gets people talking about the products or about the company. But they aren't. They are only talking about the ad.

Look at this way: they could make an ad that never mentions MSFT at all and people would talk about it. But by your definition, it would be a success!

Frankly, I see this kind of comment everywhere this ad is being discussed, and it baffles me. A lot of people seem to be confused about the difference between talking about the COMPANY (good) and talking about the AD (bad). We live in a post-modern, deconstructionist era, not the 1960s, and "awareness" doesn't cut it anymore.

theczardictates

@The Magnificen7:

Ah right, so all you can come up with is anecdotal evidence.

OK.

Drummer_Boy

@rattyuk:

To counter the bullshit that Apple were spreading. Joe Public is the target audience and he's susceptible to advertising of any brand be that Apple or Microsoft. Fortunately Joe Public doesn't really have any strong affiliations either way to start with but if one company - in this case Apple - keeps chipping away with no response from Microsoft - they pretty soon will.

Drummer_Boy

@The Magnificen7: wooow stop bashing everyone man you are an angry little blindfold fanboy... can't you respect someone else opinion???

If they don't think like you then they are stupid..well what a stupid way of thinking my friend.

Well if you think that in order to be a coherent response from MS the ads needed to be 1-to-1 like Mac vs PC well let me tell you we are not in the 30's anymore they preferred to show the diversity of the user base and that's a good thing

I really like the ads if you don't like them its ok don't be angry and don't bash everyone try to show your superior mac use brain

mpar

I think the next installment, Ballmer will eat a live rabbit in two bites.

Ken_Darrow

Man. I want more Seinfeld commercials, lol. To me these companies who want to advertise are going to be effective as long as its show at some point on some channel that people watch. Video game companies to me are the most notorious for this. I rarely see commercials for consoles. I think Sony PS2 got the most I've ever seen, and it's success was also augmented from this. Seeing more Microsoft commercials is a definate plus imo, cuz it starts helping people realize that Microsoft is still out there, and Macs aren't just the biggest things there now.

SDreamer

@closhedbb: I agree with you. Look at apples two marketing campaigns. The ipod just shows the ipod doesn't compare itself to others. Because it is the market leader. MAC commercials and for that part the whole MAC website compares itself to PC "windows". Its because it isn't the market leader. The whole basis of the MAC commercials are attack ads filled with fluff. Microsoft doesn't need to attack Apple, they are the market leader. It would be stupid to acknowledge and attack apple dead on. Lets face it Apple computers are a blip on the global market. Why raise them up to the level. I liked the Seinfeld, Gates commercials. They made me laugh.. i felt good after watching them because I laughed. I saw a microsoft logo. I associated the happy feelings with microsoft. They achieved their goal. They aren't pushing windows vista directly..but the corporate image. Same with the i'm a PC campaign...its a happy...non negative commercial. I'm indifferent to it. I like the gates ads better because they made me laugh. Is the i'm a pc a bad approach? No, its more of a unifying message.
I don't get peoples comments about trying to be cool or apple is a lifestyle. It all sounds to me like fanboy bias. If you think apple is a lifestyle...you my friend live a sad life. If you think having an apple computer makes you cool.. you are not..you are just trendy.

dvda

@OMG! Ponies!:
Well said. I'd like (read, I would not like) to see The Magnificen7 try to formulate a response to this.

Any WTF. That dude totally ganked my avatar.

AmbroseP

@The Magnificen7: I agree. The same thing was said by Britney Spears as she was carried to an ambulance tied to it "Any publicity is good publicity".

Bill Gates & Jerry Seinfeld ended up looking as that 1% of the filthy rich that look that at real middle class people as chimps.

VakeroRokero

@radiodead: Ahh yes, the average user needed to double click those pesky desktop icons is a nightmare...

UnderLoK

If the goal of the ads were to raise buzz, it was a huge success. However, it's not the goal they should be aiming for. It's like being infamous...it can be for good or bad reasons. At my office, we've been talking about it quite a bit, but nobody understands what they are about and generally don't like them. Does that mean it was successful?

As for the polling that said the majority of posts were favorable of the ads, I would say it's misleading, or a the least it's not representative of what people are actually saying. My theory is that people just don't care enough or are too confused by the ads to comment about them unless asked to do so. For instance, I don't think of MS any more unfavorably because of the ads. If I didn't actively follow tech blogs like Gizmodo, I wouldn't be on here commenting about it. It's not worth people's time to comment on something that they don't really care about. Ad campaigns should want you to go buy the product (most people probably don't even know what product it is for), or to support the company, or something. By those standards, I think MS had an epic advertising failure.

My suggestion: get a real survey done, not "analyzing" forum posts.

geowrian

Hello, I'm a Mac... and I write the checks.

Hi, I'm a PC, and I sell fish.

Jafro

@The Magnificen7: I know that hurts to see that people actually liked the commercials and that's why you have responded 50 times in this thread, but it's not up to you. Not everyone thinks the "I'm a PC" ads were horrible or an epic fail. What is an epic fail is aligning "PC" and "Windows" because if you actually did know anything about computers you would know that a "PC" runs Solaris, Linux, Windows, BSD, and OSX (among others). An Apple is a PC no matter what your master Apple tells you.

I haven't heard (that means with your ears and doesn't include maczealotfanboys.com) one person that isn't a MAC Fanboy totally trash on the ads. As a matter of fact I have heard a couple Fanboys say that they liked the commercials. The fact that you have spent so such time and effort in this thread slamming people for their views just cements the problems inherent with getting an objective opinion out of a Fanboy. I for one use Windows, Linux, and BSD, but you wouldn't catch me slamming Apple as I like what they have done with the product and even though their ads were flawed, I liked them.

There are positives and negatives to everything, but for some people there are only negatives. I guess objectivity is one for a Microsoft commercial…

UnderLoK

It's simple really, Macs deliver a better computing experience, not the confusing slop that you're stuck with in the MicroSoft world

sorry, but true in my professional opinion after 20 yrs of experience in software engineering

radiodead

I think the "I'm a PC" ad is actually quite well done. Not only does out counter the mac ads without attacking them, it tries to humanize Microsoft as a company as well. I don't think you could really ask for more in an ad like that. The Gates/Seinfeld ads were just random. They had their moments (sadly all the moments were in the very first ad) but seeing bill gates doing a commercial like was appeal enough I think.

knyghtryda

Microsoft products are complex and difficult to understand? Sounds like another person in the special ed, IQ < 50, all Apple class.

UncleArgyll

@RoscoPeeholePain:

+ Watch video

Xenocide

@ttech10: When I see a Mac add I generally feel annoyed that they imply that I cannot do the things I'm actually currently doing.

Xenocide

@The Magnificen7: Apple will NOT fight that fight any time soon for any number of reasons. I would bet money that you don't have the faintest clue why that is, but trust me... It's a fight they have lost more than once and it is a fight they are no where near ready to try again.

UnderLoK

@closhedbb: Well said!

analyticalmind84

@The Magnificen7:
Do you work for Apple? =/

analyticalmind84

@The Magnificen7:

If the "I'm a Mac" Ad said:

I'm a PC (and I'm a stodgy nerd),

I think that it might have been clearer to people about what the MS ads are trying to say and accomplish.

Altdotweb

I think it's funny that there is even a question about the success of these ads. It's obvious by all the exposure that they are successful. CP+B are masters of creating buzz with Punk Marketing. And that is exactly what they have done. I wouldn't doubt that there will be even more changes to come.
Kev
HeavyGiant.com

kevio

This isn't about preaching to loyal PC user base, but converting those who are not PC users while improving the brand image. I've actually been pretty surprised that MS would even run a campaign like this, seeing how much they dominate the market share. It seems forced, over-thought or like they are trying to use a gun to kill a mosquito that is "mocking" them. Will it be a success? Time will tell. I do know this: The ads people remember are the ones that are side-splitting hilarious or extremely clever. I don't think any of the MS ads fit that category for the majority of viewers.

johnnyabnormal

Yes because a bunch of people saying i'm a pc totally sells the operating system. Well the AD opens up with "I'm a pc and and i've been made into a stereotype" Then it just goes nowhere by throwing out people saying i'm a pc and not even promoting the OS. I mean ok you want to knock apple for making you a stereotype then at-least give reasons how it isnt. It didnt show any +'s for the OS, it didnt give any reason to get a windows based computer over a Mac. Knock apple all you want but they give reasons to switch to mac, yea the latest ads have been a little vista bashing happy but rightly so.

These ads are pretty bad.

Djnardu

@The Magnificen7:

Hear, hear!

tabaks

@Drummer_Boy: Evidence that makes sense, all you can come up with are some bullshit numbers that don't prove anything. I'm explaining why the ads are failing, and that your numbers don't make a damn difference. Nothing you showed was conclusive, as there were large indiscrepancies and large negative numbers. If you can clearly show me that the MS ads are having a greater affect than the Mac ads, or that people actually care about the product, maybe I'll shut up. You haven't, so I'll continue.

The Magnificen7

@Altdotweb: But .... it didn't.

The Magnificen7

The Microsoft ads are like...Britney Spears. You know of her and although you see why she has so much money...you surely wouldn't like to be the part of her life...shhhh...wait, I'm not done...unles you're un-adjusted, adolescent, puberty-driven horny teenager.

tabaks

@dvda: The Get a Mac ads are not attack ads full of fluff. They point out legitimate problems in humorous ways, and spell out the advantages of a Mac. They are perfect for the average Joe. And guess what? When Macs are selling the way they are, and gaining market share like they are, MS has every right to be worried, as they are no longer guaranteed to be such a dominant leader. In a while, you can expect Mac sales to continue to rise, and the Apple market share to be much higher. Do you think owning a PC is a lifestyle? The Apple product family are cool, and that makes people feel cool. They don't care what you think, because they have bought into that thinking, and it makes them happy.

And frankly, if you enjoyed the Seinfeld ads, you have some serious problems that we don't even need to begin discussing.

The Magnificen7

@closhedbb: Your point that both ads talk about PCs makes no sense. Sure, Apple talks about them, but the overall message is ... Get a Mac. Again, just talking about something doesn't automatically make it a success. The consumer has responded to these ads with a huge upswing in Mac sales. It does nothing for MS. The Get a Mac ads have become so well known, that they could literally talk about the weather and people would now it's a Mac ad, so Apple doesn't need to continue to mention themselves in every ad, as the product is already implied.

Also, in 2004, there was a little thing called 'swift-boating.' The bad image of Kerry that was completely fabricated lost the election for him, because (and I'm sure this has been proven) undecided voters are some of the biggest morons in the world. You can draw some comparisons here to the Get a Mac ads, as the flaws they point out may be slightly exaggerated for their purposes, but nothing has been completely fabricated. I really did see a PC on campus the other day disguised as a pizza box! Tricky bastard, I was really hungry too...

Now, I agree that I would rather see ads that focus on what using a Mac is ALL about, but it is in Apple's interest to continue doing what they are doing. Even an ad campaign as well executed as Get a MAc will become stale for the average Joe eventually, and I see Apple moving to Mac ads that are more like the current crop of iPhone ads. Realistically though, Hodgman and Long are selling Macs by the truck load, and people like seeing them on TV. Apple will continue to do what works until it doesn't.

The Magnificen7

@dvda: Very well spoken man, and i could not agree more, I was not a huge fan of commercials, but I liked 'em a hell of alot more than the mac ones.

DozeUser

@UnderLoK: Apple could be getting to the point of offering a version of OS X that runs on other hardware. This is a fight they are very interested in, and are better suited to go after it.

@AmbroseP: I'm pretty sure I had it first ;-) I was thinking of changing it anyway.

@OMG! Ponies!: I completely agree with you. The point I was making is that MS could be on the verge of losing its stable footing in the marketplace. They are an old fashioned business who are losing touch with their consumers. If Apple follows through on a version of OS X that is easily adaptable for business, and can run on other hardware, Microsoft could be in HUGE trouble. Mac already has Office, and the versions are very similar, most enjoying the Mac version more than the Windows version. If this happened, maybe MS would yank Office support, but they would be insane to do so, as it is still an MS product being used.

I also agree that running Windows is very cost effective on a large scale, because the Apple hardware generally costs more, and that would be hard to make up for some businesses. On the smaller scale, Mac is fairly cost effective, as the difference is only a few extra man hours of work, and can easily be made up through the increased productivity that generally seems to be provided. Again, if Apple released a version of OS X like I stated above, it could be very cost effective to run OS X in a business place on other hardware (or a cheaper Mac alternative) and MS could see their market share begin to slide. I'm not saying it WILL happen, I'm saying it's viable, and something Apple could do.

Agreed also, about the other markets and piracy. This is very deeply rooted, and would take some kind of monumental effort, or screw up, to allow Apple to gain much ground there.

Basically, the future is brightest for Apple. Public perception of Apple is much more favourable than for Microsoft, and could lead to a swing in the habits of businesses and consumers alike. Macs are already on fire in the consumer marketplace, I can't see it slowing anytime soon.

So, in the future, MS could be a bad purchase, and you could get fired for it.

The Magnificen7

@analyticalmind84: You've found me out.

The Magnificen7

@mpar: I can respect it just fine, and I do, by responding to it. Respecting an opinion has nothing to do with agreeing with it. I'm also allowed to argue my points. As an advertising student, this is very close to me. All ads are.

Sure, the ads showed the diversity of the user base, but what MS failed to get is that Apple wasn't stereotyping PC users, they poked fun at the operating system itself. The Mac base is just as diverse, so the MS ad says nothing to differentiate itself from that image.

I'm certainly not angry, I'm just passionate. It's fine if you liked the ads, just like it's fine I didn't. So, I will continue to "show my superior mac use brain."

The Magnificen7

@UnderLoK: Wowee, thanks for letting me know what 'PC' stands for. I didn't know that. The point is, Apple has chosen to call their computers a 'Mac' and Windows machines a 'PC.' I never said that PC was the be all and end all for WIndows.

I am an advertising student first, my friend. How about we stop categorizing people as 'fanboys?' All of my opinions have been objective, certainly more so than the comments from people who call me a 'fanboy' and a 'basher.' That's not an objective opinion. I have already pointed out positives and negatives with Apple.

The problem inherent on this website are that Apple hating has become a big thing. I'm not saying 'Mac ads good, MS ads bad' as simply as you think. I'm pointing out flaws and positives. There a lot of people here who agree with me, because I am crafting objective opinions and making valid points. If I refute your point, don't take it as 'bashing,' take it as an argument. You're welcome to respond if you want to. I enjoy the discussion. How about getting past the MS and Apple fanboy argument and realizing that real, everyday people use the machines too? These are the people the ads are targeting, and I've talked about why they work, and why they don't. There are people who will like the MS ads, because they fail to see where MS went wrong, or because they ares strongly connected to the Windows OS, or strongly against OS X.. More people I have spoken to have related to me how they feel MS missed the point.

The Magnificen7

Summary of replies so far:

Apple fanboys: We're so jealous MS actually made a good ad we'll just bash it and force our own opinions. Also VISTA, Apple ad copy, etc etc.
And from that, goes down to offending Microsoft and Windows users.

Microsoft fanboys: Apple ads GOT PWNED! LOLOLOLO!!one! Seinfeld was good too, but other kind of humor! Kills stereotypes! Any publicity is good publicity! etc etc
And from that, goes down to calling Mac users brainwashed design centered "noob" elitists.

People who don't want to judge the ads: MACS ARE PCS!!!!! RAAAAAGE!!! NO! I won't accept that it has become common for people to differentiate Computers with Microsoft OSs from Computers with Apple OSs using PCs and Macs! NO, IT CANNOT BE!!!

Me? C'mon, these are f*cking ADS! It's pretty obvious that almost ALL the discussion around here isn't about the ads, it's about the companies who promoted them or the products of those companies.

Because if everyone really forgot that the ad was made by Microsoft, or made in response to an Apple ad, it would neither be considered GREEEAATTTT!!!! nor be considered GODAMN AWFUL!!!

Both companies made good and bad ads, both companies have ads that are centered on funcionalities and ads that are abstract and just tries to sell an idea.

It doesn't matter what YOU wanted to see on the ad, the truth is, both types of ads exists, and both types of ads are valid. You can try to sell a product with an ad, or you can just try to sell an idea, a logo, make people talk about it, consider if it's good or bad, approve the product or make sugestions to improve it.

I don't exactly LOVE Microsoft, but I use the products... and Apple fanboys can cry as much as they want, but if they think these ads "didn't work", it's because they are TOO BLINDED BY THEIR OWN FANBOYSM TO SEE THE TRUTH.

You know why Gizmodo staff keeps publishing stuff related to these ads? It's because the ads did work. And they generate A LOT of traffic. And they make people write comments about them.

It doesn't matter if you don't have friends that talks much about it, and you've only seen lots of comments about it here on Gizmodo... if they managed to get your attention to the extent of coming to this topic and posting a comment, that's it. It has done a lot more than what other even more ambicious ads managed to do.

Bokusatsu_Tenshi

I'm a PC.

Evangelion

I remember when the X-10 webcam was one of the first products to exclusively advertise on the web, mostly in the form of pop-up ads. They got everybody talking about their ad campaign. And what were the people saying? How much they hated the company's guts!!!

It is an advertising theory that if an ad campaign gets people talking that's enough, but it's a theory that has had some epic failures.

darthuv

@The Magnificen7: You fail to notice that MS wasn't trying to copy Apple's approach showing a person being a PC and another for a Mac, MS are trying to show the people behind the box, Apple's ad's have painted the picture of those who use a PC are nerds due to the person who represents it, MS simply show the people behind the PC. Someone who is an advertising student, you must be a first year.

ittekimasu

@RE-L: they don't even immitate them. Mac ads intentionally try to make PC's look bad. The MS ad doesn't even say anything about Macs which to me is more respectable.

esubi81

@The Magnificen7: Atleast MS is not intentionally trying to make Apple look bad in their commercials.. i have more respect toward MS for that.

esubi81

@ittekimasu: You fail to notice that they were trying to copy Apple's approach. If you think that paints a picture of a PC user, and not the machine itself, you must be a first year. At life. Congrats on the typing thing though.

The Magnificen7

@Bokusatsu_Tenshi: That still doesn't make them successful in the context of what they were trying to achieve! I vote we start swinging the banhammer at people who only choose to categorize people as fanboys. Apple bashing is now officially a bigger problem than Apple loving.

The Magnificen7

@jae_mez: I lold, as you failed to put a period after 'period' LOL

Exclamation Mark?

The Magnificen7

@esubi81: They'd like to, but they really have no ammo. I can see them trying that approach soon, especially after a new Get a Mac ad that will land with the message I think it will. One of the best moves is to make yourself look better, and the competitor look worse.

The Magnificen7

@The Magnificen7:

Some people just don't get it.

Altdotweb

@Jafro:
Yo, I'm a PC, and more people use me.

Th3sandm4n

@UncleArgyll:
amen brotha.
I don't see how Macs are easier, basic concept is the same.

Th3sandm4n

@ttech10:
Japanese sex toys are a success, aren't they? :)

I don't usually talk about any ads in particular in my normal social interactions, but then again, I'm not in advertising.

When I watch a Mac ad, I just get plain annoyed. It does not make me want a Mac at all. The Microsoft ads don't make me want Windows at all. Like the point someone made earlier(I don't feel like looking for it again), if someone makes their minds up from an ad, they are pretty ignorant.

I wonder if back when the Mac ads came out any Microsoft fanboys got all up in arms?

Th3sandm4n

@Xenocide: well played sir!

Jraktal

I think it worked fairly well. It created a buzz amongst viewers whether positive or negative. I myself see it in a positive light in that Microsoft is trying to create an identity for the Windows brand, which isn't necessarily just for OSes like XP or Vista. There are several Windows branded products out there, and not everything on the PC or an OS. They have OSes for embedded systems, for mobile; MS has Windows branded programs such as the Live product suite and those bundled into other OSes and Windows products. For the longest time too many "Windows" befuddled MS consumers about what the brand represented (especially with their pretty dodgy quality track record). But everyone's got to admit, in the short few years starting from XP, MS has evolved on a massive scale from its stagnant unimpressive dominance to a more dynamic and edgy company in the face of its many rivals. They've still got a long way to go though, and one of the few things they've really never bothered to have that level of fresh dynamism was with its advertising campaign. Sure MS was making some strides in its software and services development, but the branding sucked. Case in point: Vista being a great product but marketed abysmally in the face of Apple's aggresive OSX campaigns. Sure Apple was misleading. Sure Apple was arrogant. But it worked to change the perception of Vista. To the Vista detractors: Vista ACTUALLY does well in sales and even bigger than OSX on retail and not just on pre-installed OEM shipments. It could have done much much much better though and at least would not have that popular perception of being a failure. But again, MS did nothing aggressive to at least change Vista's reputation. Everything they have done for it was not even close to lukewarm. Again, resting on complacency with sales being brisk enough not to be threatened by the negativity surrounding Vista. The recent campaign brings new hope to MS. Sure its still MS vague but it only started that way to create that buzz. The second series of commercials between Gates and Seinfeld had established that message of Windows products CONNECTING with the common majority. The I'm a PC segments defined what it was to be part of Windows in the PC segment, again showing that connection not simply as a vague majority, but with specific different kinds of people. The Windows Without Walls campaign presents the Windows brand as a simple, easy to understand, easy to run, set of products and services that get you going to whatever you need to do whether you're a scuba diving Windows user using a PC to plot your dive planning, or a high-powered executive scheduling meetings on a mobile, an astronomer researching with the WorldWide Telescope while collaborating through various Live Services.

VallisHelmer

@The Magnificen7: I am when it comes down to it a PC user(Gaming is great). I don't generally consider Windows or OSX to be superior to the other, it depends on what you do with it. These MS adds do one thing any good advert should do, THEY GET PEOPLE TALKING!!! So some apple fans think it's a ripoff of the I'm a Mac adds, so what if it gets a discussion going about how each OS is different it did it's job. I like the VERSATILITY of Windows, which does lead to some complications from the dozens sometimes hundreds of apps I may install conflicting, but a Mac comes out of the box not needing much installed unless you want a better set of Office like apps, or a heavy duty video editing app. My first computer was a Performa 578(Loved it), Second was a $500 Emachines desktop(Meh), Since then I've mostly built my own computers, but I actually sold computers for 2.5 years. I liked certain things about the new Macs, the OS is fast, clean, but unfortuanately limited by the fact that Apple thinks it's general users are to incompetent to be trusted with real access to the system. I like them, for what they are, but I've seen Macs in a retail environment(fresh out of the box) crash more times in a week than all of our other Windows display machines in the same time period. That's not to say the Windows boxes were flawless... I watched certain sets of machines(I'm looking at you Gateway) BSOD on a fairly regular basis. YAY!!! I'm a fanboy!!!! Yell at me and call me a Mac hater whatever, I don't care either way.

Shinsplitter

@Shinsplitter: Again, getting people talking = not necessarily good thing. I can agree with most of what you're saying, but you have misjudged me. You lead a relevant argument, and you're not a 'fanboy.' I have no need to 'yell' at you or call you a hater, because you are not. People who hate Mac just for the sake of it are haters, I have nothing against people who choose not to use it, as long as they don't try to slam it for no reason.

The Magnificen7

The reason people are talking about this campaign is not because it is good or bad. It's because everyone has been waiting to see if Microsoft would ever have a response to the barrage of Mac ad slams. And lo and behold, they finally do. That's why people are talking about them. And that discussion does not mean they are successful. With that said, the first spot with Gates was pretty tough to watch. And the most recent spots are pretty predictable, but not bad.

TertiaCadmium

If commercial success were based on how many people discuss it, then the Head On commercials are the best spots of all time by that logic. Sorry. If people think your commercials are stupid, that does not reflect well on your product or brand in the end. Hated the Seinfeld spot. The "I'm a PC" spots are way more strategic than they are creative, but much more tolerable overall. The whole effort gets a C+ in my book.

TertiaCadmium

the thing is, all the video was showing is that windows products are used everywhere by everyone. and BSODs are more commonly caused by shoddy drivers and hardware and not the OS coding itself. that's what MS gets for being dominant. everything bit of hardware is supposed to work for it and it should work on every platform. video cards and memory cause the most cases of BSODs out there. and think about it in this way, given all the bad rep, the headaches of windows products failing like that, why would these penny pinching big companies with their fat income bother with MS and instead use linux (which a lot of them do) and hey even mac (which they hardly do)? just a thought

VallisHelmer