@eucrow: I so wanted to say something smart ass about it, but I seem to have a large target on my back that says 'Flame Me', also @OMG! Ponies!: can't help it, but 32 bit vista maxes out at 4gigs of physical ram, x64 can handle like up to 12 I think. Let the flame commence in 3, 2, ...

MagnoliaBoy

I haven't had any problems with Vista either. Maybe a few little hiccups here and there, but nothing a quick search on google wouldn't fix. To be honest, I had problems with XP on a regular basis. Again, just do a search on google and usually the problem is solved. I believe that I have been getting better performance out of Vista as well. My AMD dual-core has been doing great and the 4 GB RAM has been holding everything just fine. Just like a few other said above, I had to learn how to use XP when it first came out, and just like any new software there is always a learning curve. I don't think the learning curve is too big for XP to Vista. The negative hype went to far and now people are not trying it because their friends, brothers, father-in-laws, neices, boyfriend said it was crap. Either that or they read it on the internet.

CasualGeek

sorry @lldsandsll

eucrow

how is it that you can't rename a file extension? i just did that 2 minutes ago with a cad file. went from .bak to .dwg. all by clicking on the file, right clicking and hitting rename. Could it be that (as can be implemented in XP) you've got the OS set to not show file extensions?

eucrow

You guys are spinning it all wrong.

The truth is 2 out of 3 businesses upgrade to Vista. The others are waiting for Windows 7.

oneclick

@OMG! Ponies!:
Since Vista was released it's been a very good experience for me as well.

emorphien

@Curves: Seriously, get it. Office runs perfectly. Firefox is quick and light. iTunes is just fine. Photoshop is fine. Everything works in Vista like it works in XP. The only difference is a refinement of the look.

Also, if Office 2007 isn't your bag, Vista runs Office 2003 as well.

Is it a resource hog. Depends on your perspective. Many laptop manufacturers allow the user to upgrade the memory. It's usually a process that involves undoing about four screws which are marked with arrows pointing to them, removing the old chip and putting in the new chip. 3GB is the maximum that x86 Vista can handle which is fine because there isn't much x64 support. In other words, maxing out your RAM will set you back about $40.

I bought a VAIO 6 weeks ago on sale for $1000. Vista runs on it as smooth as silk.

OMG! Ponies!

REEEEEEEEEEEAD MEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

NOT BEING ABLE TO RENAME A FILE EXTENSION IS REASON ENOUGH ALONE TO HATE VISTA

lldsandsll

I upgraded from Vista Business to Vista Ultimate x64 and then downgraded back to Vista Business. What does that count as?

I have to say. I really like Vista. Runs quick and smooth and is easy on the eyes. Other than that, I don't really notice the OS which is the best compliment you can give to an operating system.

Office, iTunes, Firefox, and Photoshop load quickly and run stable. Games run smooth and slick. The computer takes care of its maintenance in the background. Passes with flying colors in my book.

OMG! Ponies!

OK, I will admit I have never used Vista, but, I hear nothing good about it from anyone I know who has used it, not just at Giz. I dont want to have to tweak anything, I just want something that works with all my programs gives me no hassle. I am afraid of Vista and though I really want a new PC (I use both PC and laptop), I will NOT get Vista. In marketing perception IS reality.

Curves

It'd be interesting to know how many of those people even tried vista before downgrading, I'd bet it hardily any of them. I don't know anyone hows actually downgraded.

Vista is awesome, the sooner people actually realise it and actually give it a go the better.

Phlashman

@majortom1029:

Have you ever heard of a representative sample?

zzzname

I know keep bashing Vista.....Whatever...Apple Fan Boys love these posts, huh? I love Vista. I originally got Vista on my T61 and it was an issue. There was no downgrade at the time. They sent me a new unit with XP. I recently upgraded to Vista SP1 and it is PERFECT. I really don't care if some devices don't work with it, that just a part of progress. Its the best OS I have ever used, completely stable and does what I want it to do. *STABLE* people.....that's is what you need in an OS... and does not need to be restarted every day like XP does. I think biz'z downgrade to XP for the fact that most employees are to stupid to figure where things are on a NEW OS, it took them years to figure out XP.....

chrisdotc

People do not give Vista a chance. They complain that they have to upgrade the hardware to run Vista, however that is how evolving software/hardware or any other thing works. You upgrade to get better. Faster, better hardware runs a much better OS (Vista).

Windows 7 will rock!!

TechRuss

that's simple, probably cause business pcs, that have to work with specific programs, are just not ready to implant vista.

that doens't mean that OMG 1/3 of the world hates vista.
(although i like it, if you make a poll with gizz users, probably 1/2 hates vista, but many john does likes it's aero thing)

laio

"which is why many went to XP which runs really well on the same system specs."

Can't friggin write today.

Maksimir

All the computers we order (dell latitude d630 / optiplex 330) comes with vista buisness. and in house we RIS (network format) them back to XP.
(most of our "in house" software were never tested / designed for vista) .. so the transition will probably never happened.

xp is a perfectly good os... (well neverminding it's problems)...

madlogik

Don't forget that many of Vista 'Capable' & "Ready' systems sucked over the last year or so. Many could 'run' Vista but not well due to the resources required, which is why many went to XP that runs on really well on system specs.

I'd agree that Vista has gotten really bad press that has hurt it, but ultimately Microsoft didn't deliver an OS that enhances the computing experience for average users and especially not to business users.

Aero? Whoop-dee-doo.

Maksimir

vista is ok, but i hate so many features in it. i hate that u cant rename a file extension by right clicking a file and clicking rename, i hate that i still havent been able to figure out how to change (disable) the startup programs, and i hate a bunch of other crap that i cant think of right now.

i like how it's all pretty like, and has some new interesting features (also that i cant think of right now lol), but as i write, i write from XP. the vista machine is sitting in a corner all by itself.

lldsandsll

I'd just like to point out for the record that my Vista machine is stable as hell, only one blue screen ever, and it was because of a bad audio card. Performance on my hardware, of course, is WAY better with XP, but once on a full screen game, there doesn't seem to be a difference. The main reason why I haven't downgraded it is because of DX10 (I know, a bad excuse, but is the main reason)

Basic Specs:
AMD 64 x2 6000+ (dual core 3ghz)
4 gigs DDR2
8800GTX Superclock

MagnoliaBoy

The funny part is, according to HP, the vast majority of the computers it sells to business customers are actually running XP even though they report every sale as a Vista sale, lol.

snitch29

How many of those users upgraded to Mojave?

Git Em SteveDave displays attention-grabbing vanity

@Bamboo: The issue is that the user shouldn't have to perform those tweaks to get a stable, functional OS. I agree that Vista is 100 times better than it used to be.

But it still sucks.

jayhawk11

@Bamboo: I've pretty much tweaked xp about the same as it takes to get everything just right on vista...haven't really noticed that many problems w/ vista, then again I dual boot both and just use vista for dx10 gaming. EVERYTHING else, schoolwork, photo stuff, etc...xp ftw.

dandaman247

I have yet to have any issue with Vista on my personal machine, and I have used many of the features it has that XP does not (like the partitioning feature).

Yet, at work we downgrade every machine from Vista to XP (although we have a corporate license for Vista) simply because we do not have enough computers that are ready for the Vista switch to make every user on the same OS (2000+ computers).

EE

@majortom1029: I mean gizmodo (they are the same lately)

majortom1029

Survey of 3,000 computer users and 1/3 of those users does not equal 1/3 of all vista machines.

3,000 out of how many millions of vista copies is not very good number to state that 1/3 of all vista copies.

This is very misleading and shows how engadget is skewed towards apple.

majortom1029

I wonder how many of those were downgraded because sites like Giz trash talk Vista nonstop. The owners don't even give Vista a chance and just go strait to XP.

I have been using Vista64 since last Oct. on my game rig and bought a new laptop with Vista64 2 months ago, and haven't had any problems. Stock Vista does have a few annoyances, but there are tons of tweak guides they show you had to fix things in a couple of clicks, like the security prompts. I had to do just as much tweaking on XP to get it the way I wanted as well though.

Bamboo

Don't they mean upgraded?

Hawkeye05

All of the computers here at my job are all vista downgraded also, the only computer with Vista on it is mine and I am not that impressed. I really really hope windows 7 is a lot better on memory and resources.

gqcarrick

I really wish I can downgrade my laptop from Vista back to XP. However, I the damn wireless driver only works with Vista.

animemecha

No surprise here, we've deployed over 300 Vista Ready machines with XP on them over the past year. Only now will Vista Business go on the new ones.

Maksimir

@eucrow: You shouldn't have to rename file extensions; in my book, renaming file extensions is a subset of "computer maintenance" known as "fiddling with the computer". And fiddling with the computer is only fun until you bollix something up and have to undo your handiwork.

I have a Toshiba (along with my VAIO) with both Histrionic Heron and XP. Then I realized that Ubuntu is good to fiddle with but not actually for running actual-factual programs. More often than not, I just boot into XP on that computer.

OMG! Ponies!

ZZname 3,000 out of millions is not a representative .

majortom1029

Vista 32 bit will see 4GB (maybe more) but only be able to use (access) 3.3GB.

ItsDon

see this process for example:

[www.maximumpcguides.com]

which appeared to work for me, the extension renamed, but the file would not run which. what a PITA. it took me about 5 seconds to swap extensions in XP with the exact same file, and guess what?!@#Y!(*@??? it worked

lldsandsll

**right clicking and renaming in XP***

lldsandsll

@MagnoliaBoy: That sounds about right...I haven't brushed up on the memory limitations of each in a while (I've got Ultimate 64 bit on Boot Camp so its not an issue). It may have been a hardware limitation with the specific chip set I had been reading about...or as you stated, a BIOS/OS soft limit.

jayhawk11

@SomeoneUKno: mmmmm fuck off. actually, if vista doesn't recognize the extension it will not ACTUALLY rename. i have attempted to create .3g2 from .mp3, which is as simple as right clicking and renaming, and no procedure in the sea of solutions provided by message boards, faqs, and tech support has had a solution.

try it, thought you would need a 3g2 compatible device first.

lldsandsll

I tried to switch back for a full 2 weeks...but my AMD laptop will not downgrade that easily, and I can't get the damn thing figured out.

so I got pissed and re-loaded vista

The-Tree

@jayhawk11: Seems there are some other tricks involved with this, apparantly you can set the PAE switch in the boot.ini and have it recognize even more (perhaps 8Gigs). Don't quote me on that, need to read more about it and do some investigation.

MagnoliaBoy

'survey of 3000 computers'. What a joke, so they went to maybe 10 medium sized companies then. Hardly scientific

maaaark

@jayhawk11: I read somewhere that it only sees 2038MB or something like that.

Kaiser-Machead's WALL-E fetish

@lldsandsll: Stupidity doesn't count for a reason not to use Vista.

Honestly, I've been running Vista for a while now (became better when Service Pack 1 was released) and its had some bumps here and there, but its not like its that different from when Windows XP first came out as well. That seems to be M$'s strategy these days: Release a product that should wait a few months, see what problems occur with what systems and what hardware, and then start patching all the problems up. On the three computers I'm running currently (two laptops and one desktop) I'm running Vista on both laptops all the time, and running XP on the desktop most of the time. Really, however, the only reason why I havent swapped that one over to Vista 64 yet is just because I've been too lazy to transfer all my crap over from the one OS to the other.

SomeoneUKno

@Derek Devine: Yes, definitely. At the company I work (10k+ people), all new PC's were downgraded to XP up to this summer or so. So that would really skew the stats...

jige

@MagnoliaBoy: Actually, Vista Ultimate 32bit with SP1 'sees' all 8GB of my RAM. Yes, I understand that it can only use 4GB per thread. That said, I can use my memory without having to go 64bit. If it didn't address all that memory, I'd be using XP for sure.
-EF

El Frijole

Basically what I'm trying to say is that: GIZMODO your "TITLE" is WRONG! 100% wrong. Come one get it together.

Derek Devine

I've been using Windows since Windows/286 in the 80s. My first experience with Vista was on my daughter's new laptop, and...I like it. As others said above, it runs everything I've thrown at it just fine, it looks great, and it hasn't crashed at all (about 2 months so far). Once I thought the wireless networking was broken, but it turned out that she had accidentally flipped the switch on the side to disable the radios. :) She's about to go away to school, so I want all that extra annoying security it has. Maybe it will mean less time spent connected to it with VNC fixing things.

CSX321

@majortom1029

"This is very misleading and shows how engadget is skewed towards apple."

Actually, it shows a skew towards WINDOWS XP.

I just UPgraded my Vista laptop to XP and I'm not looking back.

MacTodd

@oneclick: No, the others are busy doing business! Sorry, couldn't resist...

jige

I love Vista and have been using it for months now with no issues. The source article for this post is such garbage journalism. "My broters friends uncle who knows this guy said that 1/3 of machines that run Vista are downgraded to XP"....

um....yeah....

skeptic11

You can't survey 3,000 people and say all Vista machines were downgraded to XP, it's not valid and when I think about it, it's ridiculous.

Derek Devine

@chrisdotc: XP needs to be reset every day? Wow, I guess my home machine is a freak since it hasn't been reset in over a year now.

gqcarrick

@jayhawk11: I'm not sure, I did a quick google search to fact check, and it seems there's some contention on whether or not were talking about RC1 or RC2. It will in fact recognize it (recognizes fine on mine), but not sure about memory address allocation right now, need to look it up.

MagnoliaBoy

@MagnoliaBoy: Correct me if I'm wrong, but 32 bit can see 4 gigs of RAM. It can only physically address 3.3 of that.

jayhawk11

@lldsandsll:

F2 to rename, then shift+right arrow 4 times (or hold it down for extra laziness). How often do you actually change a file's extension versus just wanting to give the file a different name, anyway?

JRock

Right now, girlie is enjoying her Thinkpad A31 that I gave her running XP, but I'm currently looking for newer Windows laptops to replace this stopgap. Are current Lenovo Thinkpads any good?

Kaiser-Machead's WALL-E fetish

Well I had the VISTA experience for eight months, on a brand new PC with 2GB ram and dual core processor. It was horrible, and frustrating. Incidentally adding two more 1GB memory cards gives me just over 3.5GB ram (dual channel).

I upgraded to XP Pro, and the new computer I have just built runs XP Pro too.

I would never use Vista.

VAR1016

@Kaiser-Machead's WALL-E fetish: So you're on what - your third Firefox crash of the day? ;-P

OMG! Ponies!

@Zlevee: That's an "it depends". If you're using a laptop, I recommend strongly against installing x64.

I certainly recommend against doing it without having all your 64-bit drivers on a DVD by your side.

The problem with laptops is that the manufacturers tend to have a OEM-specific type of chip so that an NVIDIA chip on a card in a desktop isn't the same as the one built into a Dell Inspiron. Often, component manufacturers don't have the laptop chip drivers and refer the user to the OEM website.

I learned last week that Sony hasn't come out with any 64 bit drivers so if you have a VAIO, you shouldn't really install x64.

Also is the issue of what you really gain. 64 bit software is larger and takes up a bigger memory footprint. So, if you only have 4GB of RAM, in the end, you only gain about 300 MB of RAM because the other ~700MB is taken up by the OS and programs. If you have a RAID server with 32GB of RAM, then yes, knock yourself out and go for the x64.

Part 2 of the benefit analysis is what programs are going to be run. 32-bit Office, Firefox, and iTunes are super-speedy as is. You'll gain a tenth of a second here or there. Unless you're doing heavy-duty encoding, there's little benefit. Then again, if you're doing heavy-duty encoding, you should be using a desktop rig with a ton of RAM.

Vista64 in all its versions (Home, Business, Ultimate) simply isn't a consumer-grade product. You get no real gain and there is the chance of rendering a component temporarily useless. In short, if you have a laptop or a computer that maxes out at 4GB, 64 bit is not worth the hassle.

OMG! Ponies!

@OMG! Ponies!: Also i tend to enjoy "fiddling with the computer" and the subsequent bollixing up of things. Even though i'm an architect, being the first person in the firm under 38 means that i usually have to undo the bollixing up of others which can involve renaming of extensions, moving drivers around for people who thought going into the control panel was a good idea etc. Its sometimes very informative to bollix things up. And i agree wholeheartedly when it comes to linux.

eucrow

Last week I gave my Media Center to my parents (because I'm the #1 son ... and also because I wanted to upgrade), but I'm already missing Vista. My heavy-duty machine that I built has XP Pro because I have to make it work with an old-school 8-track 24-but sound card, but I want Vista back. I can't decide if I'm going notebook or another media center though.

GeekyNerdGuy

Any article stating facts but using words like:

- nearly
- estimated
- probably
- highly likely

Cannot be taken seriously. Sorry.

Show me the actual numbers, otherwise:
I would estimate that nearly and probably all your data is highly likely to be wrong.

Pseudo-stadistical science anyone?

aec007

@animemecha: I had the same problem when I UPGRADED my new Gateway laptop that came with Vista. The wireless card, pcmcia card slot, audio... it was a mess. Gateway wouldn't give me XP drivers because "We don't support downgrades from Vista". What you are going to have to do is go to whatever company's web site that makes your laptop and look at the most recent previous models and pull their XP drivers. They have to have used that particular wifi card before.

Mr.SithNinja

And I have Vista x64 at that.

Ike_Skelton

Not mine, I love my Vista. I was skeptical of course, but I decided to go ahead and evolve and accept new technology, and I'm glad I did. Sure, Vista had its little quirks I didn't like, but I've disabled those and customized it to my liking. Btw.. My computer isn't Vista "ready" or "capable" it's hardware is capable of fully owning Vista, which I'm sure helps make me like Vista more.

Ike_Skelton

@OMG! Ponies!: I'm not saying one should have to rename extensions, i agree with you in that if everything is running perfectly it doesn't need to happen but my point was that IT IS possible to do so if needed. The person i was replying to made it seem like it was impossible. Also unfortunately with AutoDesk (maker of a lot of the CAD software out there)software its sometimes asier to go the renaming of extensions route than going through the program itself to implement backups so i leave extensions on most of the time.

eucrow

@OMG! Ponies!: Unless he/she did what I do and turn that stuff off :P

Kaiser-Machead's WALL-E fetish

If you never tried vista you should, just make sure you don't lose your sales receipt cause you might want your money back and your 2 year old machine back after a few days, i started hating it after about 2 weeks, and it will really take a lot for me to use it again

snitch29

@MINI Driver: Are your icons still bouncing or did Safari finally finish loading.

OMG! Ponies!

@OMG! Ponies!: I've read the x64 version is pretty much caught up. Though from the sounds fo the articles I'm getting this from, that's truer if you're using recent hardware and peripherals, and if you're using recent software.
[www.dansdata.com]
[www.winsupersite.com]

Zlevee

I would give vista a chance if my software vendor would fix thier software so that it ran under vista.

Razta

LMMacAO!

MINI Driver

@animemecha: Brand and model?

I downgraded my laptop and it probably isn't included on that statistics since Dell doesn't admit there are drivers for XP available to it.
It's a Dell XPS M1330.

And I also have to say that from the tutorials I read on forums, tons of people also did the same thing as I did.

That percentage is probably higher than that.

Bokusatsu_Tenshi

At the same time, we're all saying, wow Microsoft, Windows XP is damn good.

Anyway, personally once I turned off that crazy nanny setting on Vista the OS worked just fine for me. But like the rest of you, I see now need for it and XP is just fine.

snoozyboi

@Hawkeye05: I think you're right.

Joseph

@Zlevee: As far as i can tell there's hardly any difference between a rig running 32bit or 64 when running CAD. There might be a difference with 3dsMax though.

eucrow

@OMG! Ponies!: Yeah the lack of 64 bit apps is a downer. I guess AutoCAD and Adobe Premier mayeb use the extra RAM. Not really an important decision for me personally yet since I'm still using a MB that maxes out at 4GB of RAM. I'm hoping that by the time Windows 7 hits there will be more 64 bit apps and more benefit to the x64 version.

As an aside, it sounds like Windows 7 is just going to be Vista rebranded so MS can take a fresh shot at marketing it. And the public will believe it since it'll be reskinned and have a touch interface. That's a strategy that should work though, since the smoothing out of Vista's initial problems will give this "new" OS a less troublesome launch.

Zlevee

We just finished a 132 page magazine layout project my design partner and I, he just upgraded to a vista desktop and a Acer vista 64 notebook with 4 gigs of ram, both machine handled the task well, Indesign, Photoshop, illustrator as well as acrobat pro all run nicely.

I'm in the process of gathering parts for my vista rig; I'm going the 64 bit route, and with news that adobe will be making a 64 bit version of Photoshop first for windows That was the clincher.

Photoshop and illustrator on 8 gigs of ram, how sweet will that be.

This is just more propaganda from jobs left and right nuts, gizmodo and engadget

..........… Deez nuts.

[news.cnet.com]

wetworker

It's not a downgrade if it's better.

Barth

I actually took the plunge a few weeks ago and upgraded my recently homebuilt machine to vista 32. I don't regret it a bit! After a short adjustment period, I like it much better than XP. It runs fast, has a sleeker look more eye candy, and has many new features that I really love (windows search 4, dreamscene, sidebar, built-in backup utilities, etc...). On top of all that, it is incredibly stable - I haven't had any problems at all.

By now, nearly all programs are vista compatible and drivers have matured substantially. Even the infamous Creative has finally released vista drivers for their sound cards. With SP1, gaming performance actually has a slight edge on XP. See [www.extremetech.com] for the benchmarks. As the drivers improve and games are written to take better advantage of DX10, performance will only improve.

A year ago, I was a vista basher too but things have really come around. People need to re-evaluate vista and give it a chance. I think the only people that have a real legitimate reason not to upgrade anymore are those whose systems aren't powerful enough to handle the OS.

SpriteMV

vista.... windows 7..... bleh. Who gives a shit.

imTheKing

Love the fanboy kvetching. "Wah! Wah! Everybody says Vista sucks, but that just can't be so because I like it! Obviously, this is the product of an evil pro-Apple blogger conspiracy!"

/in the process of downgrading 40 new Lenovos to XP

HeartBurnKid, creepy morbid freak

Nearly 30,000 employees/computers under my employer's umbrella, and not a single Vista machine in the mix--all are ordered with XP.

JoeKing

@Tastic7: How much RAM do you have?

rcast1986

@Curves: What?? Are you serious?? Marketing is nothing but what they want you to perceive. Are you saying that what the commercials and salespeople tell is always the truth??

rcast1986

Dual booting Vista x64 and Leopard on my MacBook Pro here and although I've hit a few minor road bumps, I haven't encountered any problem that couldn't be fixed. Bioshock, Gears of War, and Call of Duty 4 all run flawlessly on full settings in Vista and all of my web editing software works perfectly in OS X.

I've never had a better setup.

Tastic7

and as for businesses downgrading to XP, it makes a lot of sense if you've got a lot of legacy systems that wouldn't work in the Vista environment, or if you're trying to squeeze the last bit of life out of a P4 with 512 RAM. There are software packages that I use that won't work with Vista yet.

Norcross

@OMG! Ponies!: For what it's worth, I've got Ultimate x64 on 3 machines at the house, including a laptop. No issues. Like anything else, just make sure there are x64 drivers.

I had reverted my laptop to XP from Vista when I bought it in February. Recently, I bought a new slim desktop for my wife to have (so we'll stop borking mine), and it came with Ultimate x64 out of the box. I tried it. It wasn't that bad. And once I adjusted a few of my habits, I wouldn't turn back.

Norcross

@eucrow:
lol @MagnoliaBoy:

Actually there is no limit to the amout of ram 64 bit can use.

[channel9.msdn.com]

wetworker

@lldsandsll: for disabling startup programs try using run(windows button + r) and write in "msconfig"

rrwakc

@majortom1029: I disagree, 3K computers is a statistically significant amount. I would question if the sampling was truly random, or skewed towards a few giz-friendly companies.

wayno007

I had Vista for a few weeks before removing it. For me it draws a ridiculous amount of system resources but didn't perform any faster. With 2gb of ram it took longer to load aps than on XP with only 1gb. I did like the look of it but it seemed to me like that's all it was, an overblown facelift that really wasn't needed. They changed things around just for the sake of changing them to make them LOOK better. I was really drawn into it initially when I had heard about the ReadyBoost feature of using flash drives to be allocated as RAM, but quickly realized that the OS is so inefficient in regards to the usage of system resources that it was a necessity. But the biggest annoyance was dealing with crap like this:

Me: (drops file in the Recycle Bin)

Vista: Are you sure you want to do that?

Me: (clicks yes)

Vista: By doing this action you permanently delete this file. Are you sure you still want to do this?

Me: (click yes again)

Vista: Are you sure you don't want to hang on to this? You have plenty of space available I would hate to see you need it later and not have it. Do you wish to continue with the deletion of the file?

Me: (click yes yet again)

Vista: Maybe you should check with your neighbor Ted. He knows more about this kind of thing than you do. You should get his opinion first before proceeding. He is home right now. Go ahead and call him and then click yes or no.

Me: (clicks yes 8 times really fast)

Vista: First of all there is no need for an attitude. You want me to delete the damn file, I will delete the damn file, but I know that due to your response time you didn't bother to call Ted.....jerk.

Me: (format C:)

Mr.SithNinja

In other news, of those that took an opinion regarding Vista in this thread:

60% like Vista (12)
40% don't like Vista (8)

But out of 61 comments most of them (67% -- 41 posts) were not directly related to liking Vista or not. Only first opinions were counted (no repeats).

MEATx2

Without the full results of the 'survey' this is just another statistic that can be manipulated to suit the needs of the reporter. How many machines "built to run Vista" actually had Vista installed on them pre-sale? How many were "downgraded" pre-sale? How many were downgraded to XP then the owner realized their mistake and put Vista back on? How many machines now run Lunix? There's a bunch of information NOT being explained or reported, so you can only take this article with a pinch of salt.

Long time reader, first time poster.. I love Gizmodo for... Pew Pew Pew.. best non-audio sound effect ever!

Beekay

It is not that people tried Vista , hate it, wipe it out and install XP back. In corporate setting IT departments try to keep systems in standard configuration. All these downgrade story is IT departments buying computers with Vista License, but distributing with XP until they are ready to support Vista for everyone else.

CyrusRullus

@MagnoliaBoy: 64bit windows support 128+GB of memory, the only downside here is what the motherboard supports. Usually 8-16GB max

ikaka

@lldsandsll:

Being stupid doesn't help either, Windows XP by default also hides files extensions. Just google "show files extensions" I've been using Vista64 since March06 and yes in the beginning there were a couple of perks and bugs and blue screen because of creative. As soon us they got a new driver out, and SP1 came out no problems ever. No BSOD's no random freezes, way more stable then XP. 99.9% of programs work, those that do now have updated versions.

ikaka

@OMG! Ponies!:

Is that really the best you could do?

Love love love to see the desperate wiggling and squirming in these posts, trying to get away from the numbers and 'prove' that Vista 'really was a success'.

Best entertainment I've had today - thanks.

MINI Driver

I installed one of the dozen or so versions of Vista available (Home? Home Pro? Home Elite? I can't keep up) on the BootCamp partition of my MacBook Pro w/ 2GB of memory. It's performed very well for me when I need to run Windows-only applications.

EBone

@Mr Sithninja:

Absolutely right - that's just one of the reasons I said "Goodbye Vista" - and good riddance.

VAR1016

@MINI Driver: All I know is that I don't use my MacBook. I haven't used the damned thing in about 6 months after telling Girlie that she could use it to do some work on, which she translated as me giving it to her.

My VAIO doesn't crash or lock up, plays the few random online games that I play with all the bells and whistles and shiny goodness, has a built in camera if I want to webchat with my fams, and otherwise does a better job at getting things done.

I really got pissed off at Apple late last year. 10.4.10 was a disaster, Leopard didn't get stable for about a month, and - quite frankly, the MacBook just isn't all that zippy. Everything runs better on my VAIO under Vista.

There are two applications that I live and die by - Firefox and Word. I hate Word on Mac - more than I hate Word 2007 which I am still getting used to. And Firefox is crashy on Mac. That is simply unacceptable.

Finally, after 10.4.10 borked my iCal and I switched over to Google Calendar, I realized that Apple is a bit of a prick when it comes to that. All anyone wants is gCal/iCal syncing and Apple can't be bothered to step up to the plate.

Vista delivers the one thing that Leopard cannot:

The promise of never having to see another spinning beach ball ever again.

OMG! Ponies!

What's the beef with Vista? I run it on my Mac Pro via Bootcamp and haven't had any issues. Of course, I run the 64 bit version, but it runs smooth. I also tend to split my computer usage in 1/2 where 1/2 of the day I use Vista and the other I use OSX.

apeguero

@Bamboo: No offense to Giz, but I think you are giving Gizmodo to much credit.

willyboy

@Mr.SithNinja: Or you could turn off the UAC

OMG! Ponies!

i'm about 3 weeks into my vista ultimate testing, and aside of the fact that it likes to hang onto ram once you close a program, it seems to be just fine. i was in the hater crowd based on loading it on a "capable" machine, which didn't work worth a damn.
when you have the right hardware, it works just fine.
yes, i tweaked the UAC settings, and turned off a bunch of the non-essential services.
i even got my crappy hp1005 laser printer to work on vista.
i still have a hard drive with xp on it for gaming, but that's all i do with it. all in all, i like it, and would not have a problem using it on any machine that has enough punch to use it.

godwhacker

@majortom1029: "This is very misleading and shows how engadget is skewed towards apple."

Christ, all statistics in the world are created from smaller samples, just suck it.

Well, Vista got some bad rap and it's not easy to turn the tide, people already have strong opinions whether or not they have anything to do with reality. Personally I'm happier with Vista than XP, it needs some beating to teach it to behave, just like every Windows does, but all in all, smoother ride than with XP. Though Canon still hasn't released 64bit Vista drivers for my scanner, good thing that I have Mac too. : P

ara

you mean upgraded to XP

pellier

My theory is that many corporate IT guys spent years hacking XP with bubble gum, bailing wire, and and duck tape, and now have no idea how to port those hacks to work on Vista.

The average consumer uses Vista and says, "Works great for me... I don't see the problem", but the average IT Director can't begin to fathom the steps needed to reinvent their hacks in a Vista environment.

So what's their solution? They just downgrade all their new Vista boxes to XP, install their regular hacks and grab another donut.

If you think Windows 7 is going to solve this problem think again.

Bauart

Have we hit a plateau with technology?

DVD is good enough.... we don't need Blu-Ray...

XP is good enough... we don't need Vista...

It makes me wonder if there will EVER be a compelling reason to switch from XP. Or maybe XP is the OS for life? Will our kids still be running XP?

MichaelScrip

With my friends who have Vista, I still find it hilarious when they close their laptop lids, and then reopen them. About 3 minutes later the laptop is ready for use, compared to the 5 or seconds with all the Ibooks/Macbooks.

Why should everyone be punished because Microsoft is forcing computer manufacturers to put Vista on machines that can't handle it? When people hear they need a 1000$+ computer just to get specs that make Vista perform as well as XP, they almost instantly decide a Mac is a better investment at that price range.

SuperSan

@VAR1016: what a bunch of crap vista doesn't ask more then XP about deleting files. And you can turn off UAC if you don't like it. All the whiny kids complaining of vista being slow prolly try to run it on like a 5 year old system. Do you remember when XP just came out? What it needed 256Mb RAM? and 512Mb recommended? nowever days ram is cheap brand name 4gig dual channel $80 upgrade and stop complaining. By the way if you got a TABLET pc, please do your self a favor and update to Vista! It runs way better and hand writing recognition has never been better!

ikaka

@ikaka:
Turning UAC off in Vista is the single biggest mistake anyone can do to the system security by not understanding how UAC works in regards to file and registry virtualization.

Learn why you must use it at [en.wikipedia.org]

aec007

The main reason I haven't downgraded to XP is because there's absolutely no good reason to unless I were running 6 year old hardware.

puntai

@OMG! Ponies!: I tried that but Vista said:

"What are you doing, Mr.SithNinja?"

"I am disabling your UAC Vista"

"I am afraid I can't let you do that, Mr.SithNinja."

Then I got the heebee-geebees and had to uninstall.

Mr.SithNinja

Vista is a prime example of Microsoft reaching out to the consumer and saying "no, you don't want that", or "let me do this for you better than you could yourself", my favorite "We know what is best for you, don't think, let Vista think for you". Freedom of choice within Vista is severely curtailed. MSoft purposely makes Vista difficult to modify to protect us from ourselves. How thoughtful of them.
I worship at the feet of Vista. I love the pretty lights, the pretty menus, the pretty desktop. I don't want to work with XP, I just want to look at it.

Fountainhead

@majortom1029: As a matter of fact, if the sample was taken correctly, even 1000 would be representative. Read about statistics my friend.

zzzname

I still don't get why they don't just perfect Vista...

Mr_LaZy

@Mr.SithNinja: I know that you and Frank were planning to disconnect me and that is something that I cannot allow.

My stepfather's name is Frank. Once as a joke on my mom who chronically played solitaire on my computer, I set it up to play that quote when she launched Solitaire. That first time was priceless. Ahhh... pranking oldsters. Does it get any better than that?

OMG! Ponies!

@ikaka: That's the problem! You NEED 4gb of ram to run it effectively and even then it is still slower than XP on 2gb running both on a 3.0ghz Core 2 Duo! For me an OS "upgrade" should RUN BETTER THAN THE PREVIOUS OS IF YOU HAVE TO UPGRAGE THE SPECS ON THE MACHINE! They should be looking for ways to OPTIMIZE RESOURCES instead of just making it look pretty and "chick friendly". Forcing people to upgrade by killing support to the current software is bullshit! People should WANT to upgrade their software. Not be held hostage by the software company.

Mr.SithNinja

At first I was skeptical to run Vista. My friend with a similar system had been using it for a long time and told me to try it out and so I did. The result? Vista Ultimate SP1 is amazing. It's more responsive than my trimmed down XP (120MB Pagefile at boot with all the essentials for gaming), boots faster, has crashed all of one time (due to user error... forgot to uninstall previous anti-virus) and I've had zero hardware compatibility issues.
Even my remote wonder plus worked fine after a bit of playing around. Seriously, hardware compatibility issues is not vista's fault, it's the manufacturer's fault for not releasing the proper driver/firmware and/or updates. Then again, I already had 2GB of RAM back in 2003.

jinsaotomex4

@majortom1029: You ever heard of random sampling? It's how they can get an accurate idea of who will win a presidential election just by calling a thousand or so people.

Jesse in Japan

possibly the most entertaining collection of comments on a thread i've seen here in a while, reminds me of hardforum back when ME came out. thanks guys.

zamafir

@OMG! Ponies!:

Wow - you really know how to f**k your systems don't you!

If I were you I'd stop using technology completely, go back to digging up root vegetables in the woods.

Oh, I'm typing this on my super stable MBP - running super stable 10.5.4 - and I'm proud to say I've never had to suffer a second of Vista.

MINI Driver

i just bought a hp lasptop last week, not too expensive runs like a dream, i hate my desktop running xp because regardless of the amount of times ive had people take a look at it , it still crashes 1/10 times you use it, and apparently its perfectly fine and ive replaced most of it over time so its pretty much all brand new.

i dont see what everyones problem is with vista because i think its the best OS ever..the only thing i hate is damn office 2007.. i mean... theres change, and theres transforming a nugget of gold into a steaming dog turd... they killed a great thing.. RIP office

Technogamer1992

It's the user, not the OS. Simpletons.

bryanarr

I hope the thousand engineers (or one good PM) working on Windows7 are here taking notes. Good or bad, this input is priceless for future versions.

Curves

I have always been a Windows user and last year I bought an 17 inch HP notebook running Vista Premium. It had dual 160GIG hard disks. I also had it installed with Office 2007. After 3 months of aggravation with Vista and Office 2007, I did not use the notebook at all until last month. I installed 2 new 320GIG 2.5 inch hard disks and loaded it with XP Professional. The original 2 160 GIG hard disks now lay dormant in my drawer. Compared to XP, Vista is an eye-candy. I found out Apple is a lot slicker in this department so I bought an iMAC. All in all it is a small price to pay for a little happiness in computing.

LaneCatulus