Points are stupid... why can't I just use real money? Isn't it Congresses job to make money anyway? We need to put a stop to this anarchy.

Rabid Penguin

@ANoel: HAHA! Exactly my point.

Now if someone could enlighten me as to why consumers would ever want to make a purchase using anything other then their native currency I would be much obliged. Drugs and sex withstanding (of course).

Johnny Chimpo

@Johnny Chimpo: Microsoft points are just like stamps or subway tokens. They are a promise to render a service or product at a later date to the holder, in exchange for actual money today. Like stamps or tokens, they are only honored by the issuer (try using an American stamp in Japan or a Fed Ex package). You probably use "proprietary money" all the time. Anytime you give actual money that entitles you to something in the future you are, in effect, injecting "proprietary money" into the transaction.

"Currency" is a pretty slippery concept. But I think ANoel is right, MS points count.

The biggest difference between MS points and the other stuff is that a point is not transferable to a third party. But that is just a matter of limiting the license, it doesn't change the fundamental nature of the barter.

Promotional points are basically just a rebates, though. You don't exchange any money to get them, so they're really not part of any barter. Like most rebates, they are of limited duration. I wouldn't call them "fake currency" because they don't purport to be currency anymore than a discount card you get in the mail is.

In either event, this is arguably overly technical semantics. And the work week is almost over for me. For those in the US: have a great Fourth.

makanai

@Johnny Chimpo:
Yes it is.
Covers wampum, gold, IOU's, MS Points, etc... but, watch out for the "magic beans", they are fake.

ANoel

"points you buy normally don't expire"

Wait is that "points you buy normally... don't expire"
or "Points you buy... normally don't expire"?

Those could mean two different things entirely.

dallasmay

@ANoel: That's a pretty broad definition of currency. I think that Jason's fake reference illustrates the limited nature of MS's point system.

Personally I think it is ridiculous and has kept me away from making purchases. Proprietary money? Who comes up with this stuff?

[www.tobyjones.com]

Johnny Chimpo

Man, that's lame. What the hell can I buy for 40 points?

ripfire

makes sense really, otherwise they could never write it off of their balance sheet

digitalhen

Jason, Microsoft Points is a currency (something that is used as a medium of exchange). Maybe time-sensitive, but not "fake".

ANoel

ouchies!

HaLfRiCa

@Johnny Chimpo: I see your point, but for parents with kids it is the easiest way to control spending habits. It's much easier to give a kid 1000 MS points then an AMEX with a $20 limit. It also lets them control their spending habits without bothering me so much :)

vandiemen007

"WE DO NOT ACCEPT ITCHY & SCRATCHY MONEY"

M. Night's The Halfshafting

@Johnny Chimpo: ". If I want to download last night's episode of The Colbert Report on Xbox Marketplace I don't want to have to do a mental conversion of what the dollar cost is."

You shouldn't be wasting your points on Colbert. Full episodes are free online... on his webpage.

Rabid Penguin

Disney Bucks are the bees' knees.

Kaiser-Machead's Chips Ahoy!

@makanai: Thanks for the response and pointing out everyday examples of "proprietary money" but those items are often a means to and end. In other words, I buy a stamp so I can send a letter. I get a parking pass so I don't have to walk to work. Et cetera.

My point is that in the case of purchasing music, a tv show, or a game on my Xbox why would I want to purchase points? When I get a new TV I don't have to purchase Best Buy Dollars. When I pay my cellphone bill I don't need to make sure I have enough Sprint Bucks.

So you see for me it is more about consumer convenience. If I want to download last night's episode of The Colbert Report on Xbox Marketplace I don't want to have to do a mental conversion of what the dollar cost is.

I'm questioning what currency is per se but rather why this model is consumer friendly.

Johnny Chimpo

Gift certificates also generally have an expiration date. This doesn't surprise me. Now if points I bought expired.. I'd be pissed. Luckily I almost never buy points.

Xenocide

Dollars, Euros, Rubbles... I can almost smell a new currency coming... "Riaas"

ANoel

Because Microsoft is never content to let a competitor screw the pooch alone.

OMG! Ponies!

@Fifth Echo: Microsoft is a behemoth of a company. I can go into Wal-Mart and buy a pack of Juicy Fruit with my credit card, why can't I do that on XBox Live. When you go to iTunes to buy a song you spend $0.99 for a song, not 23.4313.49 Apple Token Credit Chips... I'm just saying... I'm not a big fan of tokens.

Rabid Penguin

@Rabid Penguin: Why? Because it costs money for each credit card/debit card transaction to be processed. If they allowed you to individually purchase some of the low-point items (themes, gamerpics) without charging you for additional "points" that can be redeemed later, they'd be losing money on each transaction.

It's no different than going to a restaurant or store that won't allow credit/debit card purchases under a certain dollar amount - otherwise they lose money on the transaction.

I think the bigger issue is that, unlike Nintendo, they don't do a $0.01 to 1 point conversion ratio...that's just clever marketing to mask the actual monetary price of some of the things that you can waste your money on.

Fifth Echo

@ANoel: "Jason, Microsoft Points is a currency"

Not if it expires.

@Johnny Chimpo: "why consumers would ever want to make a purchase using anything other then their native currency"

I seem to recall when they started this, it was so kids could buy stuff without a CC. Their folks could charge some points for them on a card or someone could buy them gift points. Plus you had the promo points added in.

@M. Night's The Halfshafting: "WE DO NOT ACCEPT ITCHY & SCRATCHY MONEY"

How about Schrutebucks? (I just love to say "Schrutebucks.")

GadgetPlay

I don't know if it has changed, but I bout 10 bucks of skype credit and it expired after 3 months...that was the last time I used skype...

moonmen